filming out of a seaplane

[TJ Hellmuth]

I'm shooting some second unit for a film in the bahamas and today they brought up aerial photography, and they have little money for it, so they can't rent a tyler mount or anything. They are really wanting to shoot out of a seaplane because he can get it for cheap. The pilot assures him this would be easy. Has anyone shot out of these with a RED or similar sized package? I'm considering convincing them to go with a chopper, even without the mount, but I wonder if a plane could be any smoother despite all of its other limitations. I don't know how slow a plane can go or what the viewing angles feel like. I think we need to shoot islands, and a car driving on small roads. I've never been in a plane that size and I don't know what it would be like to shoot out of one. Any experience out there?

 

[Jeff Coatney]

First of all, the seaplane will get you more flight time, you'll have more room to work in, but you really need to shoot through an open window. The spray on take-off will streak the plex on the windows and the salt air tends to scratch the plex over time, clouding it. In order to shoot out the window, you won't be able to have any piece of the camera sticking out of the plane, the slipstream will windmill your mattebox and pieces could fly off even at less than 100 knots airspeed (especially true in Helo). Seaplanes also are high-wings with top mounted engines, which means you could get the prop disc in your shot without being aware of it.

Without a mount, you're limited to shooting out the side of a Helo with the door off. The vibrations are pronounced in a Helo, unless you're in an A-Star or a Jet Ranger, which it doesn't sound like those are affordable options. In Helo shooting, you can get closer to your subject and move around it slower, but your ability to frame anything other than from the side is limited sans mount. Without the mount, you're not much better off than in the Seaplane, unless you plan to hover or get very close to the ground.

In either scenario, you want to shoot CF cards. We've shot Helo with the drives but they can drop frames easily. Hope this helps.

 

[Dave Blackham]

In either scenario, you want to shoot CF cards. We've shot Helo with the drives but they can drop frames easily. Hope this helps.

If you do have to attempt showing to a disk, use a long drive cable and put it in a foam case, the one it comes in new works fine with the middle removed. Place it vertically along the planes longditutanal axis. We have had good successes with this method with a wing mount and long drive cable. Jeff is right though shoot to a card or Red Ram where you can, particularly with an expensive exercise like this.

Whatever you do make it safe.

 

[Mike Prevette]

CF cards for sure.

Ask if removing a door is possible.

Most Floatplanes are high wing, so make sure your shots involve looking down.

making a V out of bungi cords to support the camera will help deaden vibration.

You didn't make it clear what kind of shots you need. Pirouette shots are tough in a plane but strait tracking is easy. Most Float planes will fly safely well as slow as 120kph, so be aware you will outpace most ground transport.

 

[Michael Hardwick]

I shot from a Piper Cub with floats shooting air-to-air footage of another plane in flight, for a feature in Alaska.

The Cub is a tiny little thing that is very cramped, with a pilot in front, passenger directly behind type layout. I shot handheld, had to open the door/window mid flight and try hard to keep the rig out of the wind stream. It worked fine... just a simple parallel tracking shot

CF cards are the only way to go, and I would strip the rig down to its smallest expression. No clamp on matte-boxes! The hardest thing was getting the camera up onto my shoulder, the bungee cord idea sounds like a winner, wish I had done that.

Oh... make sure you can stow the rig securely for take-off, landing or whatever. Our pilot did a little impromptu barnstorming that made holding onto the camera a difficult situation.

 

[nickcolombini]

I've shot in helicopters, small planes and even a fan powered glider with the red drive. Used the 6ft cable and wrapped the drive in a couple sweatshirts and it worked fine (dropped a couple frames in the glider though had to switch to cf cards during the flight). But I would definitely bring back up cf cards incase you start getting dropped frames.

Like others are saying here a problem is going to be your lack of framing options without getting a wing, propeller or landing gear in the shot. Always a good idea to communicate with the pilot before the flight so he knows exactly what you are trying to shoot. In a way he has as much control over the framing of your shot as you do.

 

[TJ Hellmuth]

Thanks guys this is great advice. This is all very useful. I too, use red drive with a 6ft cable packed into a case. I actually use a storm case with padding, same deal. I've also used beer cozy foam to wrap the drive on the shock mount VERY TIGHTLY with no openings, complete coverage. But I wouldn't recommend that one. I did get 2 out of about about 30 clips with dropped frames. When that happened I cut, then re rolled and missed nothing. And yes, I definitely go out with CF cards for backup.


I'll ask the pilot if he can remove the doors and give me a seat. 120mph sounds pretty tame, that's not bad.

Bungee cord idea sounds awesome, thanks for that.

How about smoothness and overall steadiness, how does it compare to a jet ranger? Is the horizon shifting more or less in a seaplane?

Again, really helpful. Thanks!

 

[Matt Uhry]

How about smoothness and overall steadiness, how does it compare to a jet ranger? Is the horizon shifting more or less in a seaplane?

Again, really helpful. Thanks!

It depends mostly on the atmospheric conditions that day. if the air is choppy you'll have quite a bit of bounce, next is the pilot and plane. EARLY mornings will usually get you the best air, but just depends on the day. You can fix some shake with "steadi-shot" software so shoot things a little wider than you need.

Shooting from planes is fun, but understand that shooting air to ground from fixed wing planes is difficult and dangerous, I can't think of any situations where you would not get much better shots in a Jet Ranger or A-star.

Make sure you trust the pilot....Have fun.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

 

[Stefan Christou]

Yeah make sure the pilot is a total ace or you could quickly end up dead dead dead.

Just to let you know I've got a lot of experience flying about in light fixed-wing aircraft, my old man is a real hotshot but I'm not so take what I'm saying seriously but with a slight pinch of salt.

A float plane can fly at 50mph depending on the model and the weight of the floats, but remember the floats are big so will drastically reduce your window for framing, also the wing will dip to obscure anything you are shooting in a turn and will have a large strut obscuring the view forward from the side door.

Other than that I strongly urge you to consider using a steady cam AND gyroscopes, if you are unsure about which types PM Peter Majtan, he has experience of this directly. Also make sure you are strapped in or you might end up going out the window, and remember that you sitting in the middle of a light plane with a quite heavy piece of kit putting it's balance off. Oh and don't accidentally knock the controls or get caught on the yoke.

Have fun, asses your framing before you commit to flying (you know, sit in the plane the day before so you can do some blue sky thinking about your shots that eve and plan what you may be able to get) and don't get killed.

S

 

[Todd M.]

Have fun, asses your framing before you commit to flying (you know, sit in the plane the day before so you can do some blue sky thinking about your shots that eve and plan what you may be able to get) and don't get killed.

S

This advice is probably the most important. Take plenty of time to familiarize yourself with the plane and how you will operate within it before getting into the air. This should also include planning for emergency situations. My friend was luckily able to escape with his life from a plane crash in the Keys several years ago. His DP was not. Safety first and do lots of planning.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/3575590.stm

 

[Michael Brennan]

aerials 101

aerials 101

Aerial filming is a big subject!

The don't and do's rules
Don't get onboard if the pilot is not a commercial pilot.
Don't get onboard if the flight is not being operated under public transport cat flight rules.
Dont get onboard if the pilot has less than 1000 hours and don't be afraid to ask.
Dont back yourself into a corner with a narrow window of opportunity to fly.

Don't try and invent a bungy rig on the day. Law requires that you must have an unobstructed exit. As has been mentioned, such a rig was a major contributing factor in the death of a DP.

Almost all filming accidents, heli or fixed wing in the past 10 years involved shooting with a door off or shooting hand held. There have been no serious injuries that Im aware of, involving use of stabilised nose mounts whilst filming (apart from the mid air collision of the two news choppers.)

Strap a razor sharp divers knife to your leg.
Wear a helmet.


Your life/mortgage insurance will probably not cover you for the flight.
The trillion dollar accident insurance quoted by the charter company is usually legal liability insurance and so only accessible by suing and only if someone was legally liable ie negligent. If it was a genuine accident ie bird strike they won't payout more than the legal minimum

Not wishing to be a killjoy, but I usually am on this subject and not wishing to take comments by others out of context, my advice is don't set out to have an adventure or have fun as you'll risk corrupting the pilots comfort zone and possibly your own.

It is dubious to set out to have fun shooting in a F1 pit lane, shooting car to car or running hand held through a crowd. If you are inexperienced shooting aerials especially hand held, especially in a fixed wing and especially in a float plane shooting a moving ground target, then it as just as demanding and difficult. The shoot can easily become dangerous due to poor judgement and human errors.

If production are balking at renting a chopper and mount, you may remind them that last year a court awarded damages against the producer of a movie who (in general) provided inadequate safety measures for a heli shoot that went wrong and killed the camera operator.


Plan which direction you can fly and how you want the shot to develop in advance, shooting out the left door means anti clockwise orbits only and vise versa for right door. Consider wind direction so that you'll be flying into wind getting the shot you want.

Many accidents and near misses occur when pilots are asked to fly downwind due to direction of travel of the subject or direction of sun.
Do your best to plan this scenario out of the shoot altogether.


Manage expectations of the director, the results you will get may be erratic.
Don't plan for the onboard director to be wholly relied upon to "sign off" the shot, as whilst in flight it is often difficult to gauge how bumpy a shot is.


Plan for a test flight or opportunity to land and discuss the results and reconfigure if necessary.

Fixed wings can be smooth, flying over water is usually pretty smooth air.
You wont be putting the lens into the slipstream if you want smooth shots at 120 knots!
Don't blame or otherwise pressure the pilot for not being able to do a perfect orbit of a stationary object if there is more than a 10 knot wind.

If you are orbiting slowly then you should be traveling at stall speed plus 10 knots plus double the wind speed. Inexperienced/excitable pilots can forget about airspeed whilst they try and deliver the perfect orbit and so they slow down on the downwind leg and stall.
If you shoot at a higher frame rate they can fly faster.

Approach the shoot along the lines that you will be lucky to get the combination of good framing and a steady shot at the same moment.

Coordinating ground action adds a level of difficulty to the shoot.
Air to ground radios essential. Radio in car ideally operated by someone other than driver. Keep the action simple for starters. Car traveling in straight line aircraft traveling in straight line.
Have a backup plan to communicate visually as air to ground comms are notoriously unreliable in the hands of film crew. Flashing landing lights can be a cue. Cellphones can work some of the time. Backup plan would dictate that the ground action continues until they can't hear the aircraft any longer.

The suggestion to use a steadycam i hope refers to use of a tyler side mount (because a steadycam is lethal in an aircraft) but a tyler side mount in general won't fit in just any fixed wing.
Renting two kenyon gyros isn't a bad idea, if you do, try practice shooting from the side of a van to become accustomed to the effects of the spinning mass on panning. Note that they will increase bulk and weight and may become a liability in bumpy weather.

Consider shooting at high frame rates to reduce low frequency wobble.
Shoot at 30fps in any event.
Try some higher altitude wide shots at say 5 to 10,000 feet these are easy enough to shoot and stabilise in post.

By all means enjoy the experience if you can, but you have a job to do that is best done in a controlled and considered frame of mind with the highest level of professional craft you can muster.

With detailed planning and testing a good pilot will be able to understand the limitations of angles and equipment and work with you.

Hope this helps!


Mike Brennan
ouch... thats a long post!

 

[TJ Hellmuth]

Thanks guys. Very good concerns. That's really sad about Neal Fredricks. And very good to keep in mind during the process. This is a really useful thread I think.

 

[Michael Brennan]

Thanks guys. Very good concerns. That's really sad about Neal Fredricks.

NTSB report here.http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=MIA04FA119&rpt=fa

Areas of interest for those involved with aerial filming

It is unclear how pilot was found for the job.
Aircraft was rented by the pilot. Better to rent from a charter company and then let them give you a list of their pilots. A charter company would lose its license if safety rules are broken. If the charter company supplies the pilot you have better governance of flight safety rules and insurance cover.

Despite flying over water none of the passengers were wearing life preservers. (I'm not saying that it was a legal requirement that they should have been worn in this case, nor am i saying if the outcome would have been any different)

The aircraft was fully loaded with passengers, two of whom were probably not critical to the success of the mission.
One passenger took medication that sent her to sleep for part of the flight.

Pilot said he was unaware of the safety rope installed by his passenger.
Safety rope did not have an emergency release.

Cameraman was not wearing a helmet.

To break the chain of events that potentially would lead to a catastrophic accident requires only one person in the chain to say "NO"



Mike Brennan

 

[TJ Hellmuth]

This is encouraging.

http://www.vimeo.com/8408942

Impressive for no stabilization. The aircraft is really self stabilized in ideal conditions it looks like. Seems to me like there's some good stability to tap into there. Rather than fight the plane, I feel like I want to use it. In some videos there's a mount on the nose as well as the wing. I'm finding out how he rigged them and considering the safety of that as a second camera (7D?). There would be a slew of problems with doing that. Iris control especially. I believe that in the video they use small HD Sony cameras onboard, then an EX3 on the ground.

Good news is the pilot is a commercial pilot with 16 years of doing this daily. His website has a gallery of images including Johnny Depp and other celebrities in his plane, so he looks solid, and I'll still check about "operating under public transport cat flight rules".

anyhow:

cool videos, although I would not want to be flying two planes that close! Don't think I'll be doing that.

thanks again. Hopefully I'll post some footage if I have access.