Red's 18-85mm zoom or save up for Red Primes?

[Mark Inducil]

Hello everyone,

I've been pondering whether I should go and purchase Red's 18-85mm zoom or save up for the Red Primes. From what I understand the Primes will work well with the Epic's 5k sensor but does anyone know how the 18-85mm zoom will perform when you switch from the One to the Epic? Apologies if this is such a noob question.

Thanks in advance,

Mark

 

[jimhare]

I would be thinking more of how I will use the lens. T3 is a bit slow for a lot of situations and the extra light in the RPP make a lot of difference.

I started with a Red 18-50 T3 and eventually had to sell it and get primes, purely because of the speed.

 

[Stephen Lovett]

Hi Mark.

What Jim said.

A close second is the fact that the 18-85 is an absolutely monster. Great lens but throw on an FF4, MB-20, battery and drive and the supporting hardware (with evf) and you're at 40 pounds.

It's totally badass lookin, but run and gun, uhm, not so much.

Steve

 

[jimhare]

Hi Mark,

What Stephen said. :beer:

I did some handheld last week with no MB or rods and used very lightweight primes. I thought I was going to die after about 15 minutes.

40 pounds? Fogediboutit...

 

[Stephen Williams]

Hi,

Only 40 pounds hand held, how times have changed. That would have been considered lightweight in 1979.

Stephen

 

[Pawel Achtel]

What they said. :iagree:

Advantages of a zoom:
No need to do lens changes on set (live action)
Zoom ability

Disadvantages of zoom:
Slower speed
Large weight
Lower optical performance

Advantages of primes:
Smaller Size and weight
Faster Speed
Optical quality

Disadvantages of primes:
You need many lenses to cover your angles
Need to do lens changes

 

[Costelloe Michael]

Hi,

Only 40 pounds hand held, how times have changed. That would have been considered lightweight in 1979.

Stephen

Stephen,

I remember being on set in this same century and doing a 'quick' hand held 'POV' shot on a feature and saying to the guys, don't bother setting it up as lightweight, just stick it on my shoulder. PV Millenium, 1000' mag, 11-1 lens, MB20, FF and small FP's LCD monitor, probably about 60lb / 70lb in all. You couldn't run around with it much but the weight was quite reassuring to work with, made the camera less volatile and jumpy somehow. Red One with prime lenses and WFF/LMB combo L/W LCD is more like 16mm channel.

Mike C

 

[Will Keir]

What they said. :iagree:

Disadvantages of zoom:
Slower speed
Large weight
Lower optical performance

Hey Pawel, I'm pretty new to lenses and was wondering what you mean by.

Slower Speed

Lower Optical performance

My guess is slower speed= Less light that can go in the lens, so your getting darker shots than with a prime?

My guess for lower optical performance is the glass isn't as clean or there are less pieces of glass one has to look through?

Thanks for a heads up on this,

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Yes, slower lens = smaller aperture = darker shot and larger depth of field.

Zooms are often compromised by the very fact that they can zoom and therefore require more optical elements. Distortions and aberrations are not optimised for a single focal length, but for a range of focal lengths.

In general, zoom lenses are larger and heavier than primes. They are also not as sharp and often exhibit more distortions than primes. They also flare more easily. Also zoom lenses do not have as large maximum aperture as primes do. For example, Master Primes are T1.3 and Ultra Primes are T1.9 where a zoom, like LWZ-1, is T2.6.

If, for example, you are shooting in a theatre or night exteriors, forget zooms. They are too slow.

But, if you shoot live action with one camera, forget primes, because you can not zoom.

Of course, lenses differ from brand to brand and model to model, so it is hard to generalise. You may find that Ruby 14mm-24mm zoom lens (converted Nikon 14mm - 24mm f/2.8) may be actually sharper than some primes.

It is very hard to advise which lens to chose beacause this largely depends on the style of filming you do and the budget.

It is like a difference between a sports car and a truck: they both have their uses and which one is better depends on what you are trying to do with it.

 

[Guidofilippi]

What they said. :iagree:



Advantages of primes:
Smaller Size and weight

This is slowly (or rapidly?) changing...
Guido:001_unsure:

 

[Jochen Schmidt-Hambrock]

I´m totally overwhelmed with the quality of my RPPs, but I´m glad I still have the Nikon mount.
Comparing the weight of the RED 18-50mm to the Nikon 17-35mm is not such a big difference, but comparing the weight of the RPP 35mm to its Nikon equivalent .....That RED lense is a huge beast. Single wildlife shooting without a Sherpa or two? You have to be fit.

Jochen

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Hello everyone,

I've been pondering whether I should go and purchase Red's 18-85mm zoom or save up for the Red Primes. From what I understand the Primes will work well with the Epic's 5k sensor but does anyone know how the 18-85mm zoom will perform when you switch from the One to the Epic? Apologies if this is such a noob question.

Thanks in advance,

Mark

Mark, seriously "PONDER NO MORE" I imagine you as many Pros here do understand that in Photography and Cinematography your work is allowed by the type of lens you have in your arsenal.

Zooms are very different from Primes, and they are both needed as they provide a different service both on set and in studio shooting.

Having said the above, the RPZ 18-85 is an absolute stunning ZOOM, CUDOS to RED, it is true that image quality tends to suffer with Zooms, vs. Primes but in recent times technology has allowed for this gap to be made ever so small, and in the case of the RPZ it is particularly true, as the difference in image quality with the RPP it is not seen by any naked eye, and I do truly challenge any one to refer to me what has been shot with what when viewed on a 4K Sony Projector on a White screen, properly calibrated to show maximum resolution, they will not, and I'm not interested in LAB test which could and will show some differences in Chromatic aberration, Barrel distortion and Flaring resistance, as well as Sharpness edge to edge, but this Lab test would also show that the difference is truly so marginal that very careful attention must be played to how this test are conducted.

So bottom line, Get the RPZ 18-85, I promise you will not regretted, just do take note that it is a very large and heavy Zoom, I love mine and it has been a pain not having time to shoot with.