Viper Film Stream

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

So let me rephrase it...

The SUPER digital cinema camera will have...

It will have S35 size sensor like RED and D21...
It will be 4:3 like D21
It will use the REDcode and all the Greeme magic like RED
It will have a mechanical shutter like D21 and Viper
It will have an optical viewfinder like D21
It will use pixel binning to archive a native 16:9 and a native 2,35:1 like Viper does
It will have the 12+ DR that Viper has
It will have a crazy resolution of 27Mpixels like Viper
And a super forum as REDuser is... like RED has...!!!

Ohh and an ergonomic design like an AATON... a bit irrelevant but somehow relevant...

So thats my dream...

 

[Andrew McCarrick]

Well they (Band Pro) pointed me to the Canon Anamorphic atachment but it looks ridiculously long for hand-held work.

New DigiPrimes??? ok...

To put an anamorphic 35 to an adapter needs a 4:3 sensor... Viper is 16:9... so its not working either...

I'm not getting why you'd need a 4:3 sensor?...

Wouldn't a 16:9 sensor with a 1.33 anamorphic produce 2.37?

 

[Cüneyt Kaya]

Well it a low budget project and I can get a Viper for 400 bucks a day.

Viper and S.Two recorder = 800 a day = 4800 for two weeks * 2 cams = $9600

So if you can find me two full RED packages for under 15k (for 2 weeks), then I'd shoot RED.

i`ll get you definitly two for two weeks cheaper

 

[Steven Caesare]

The image in the 1:1 crop its being made with very odd lens system...

The light in this crop passes through:

1. Front lens Zeiss ZF 50mm
2. SGblade 35 DoF adapter spinning ground glass
3. Condenser lens to minimize vignette
4. Image invert prism block
5. Relay lens that mounts to the camera
6. CCD prism block
7. finally on 3 x CCD

Did you expect something cleaner? RED has just a lens...

Well, in your original post you said:".. it uses oversampling in order to deliver the cleanest 1080 signal... ", and then subsequently provided these images as addditional ammunition.

They don't help your argument, IMO. Perhaps removing the additional lens system provides a cleaner image, but as the comparison stands, the Viper + 35mm lens adapter doesn't hold a candle to RED's image.

-sc

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

They don't help your argument, IMO. Perhaps removing the additional lens system provides a cleaner image, but as the comparison stands, the Viper + 35mm lens adapter doesn't hold a candle to RED's image.-sc

Not "perhaps"... it really is, a day and night difference...

We use adapters to put beautiful dirt in the image... film is not so clean as RED is... it is totally subjective... I have DoP's over my shoulder when doing CC and they push me to put dirt in the image... they don't like the "clinical" super clean RED image...

We even filmrecord on camera negative to get the dirt...

So as an engineer I like the super clean... but artistically, DoP's don't like that...

Not a candle... have you ever tried to pull the sat curve on red/yellow in a low light scene to lift the skin tone with footage from RED and Viper to see the difference?

Yes, Andrew you are right the 1.33 anamorphic's would work...

But I still prefer the DigiPrimes route... but again is aesthetics... as I said above, the dirt and the anamorphic artifacts is what we are after...

 

[Gary McClurg]

I don't have time to read all the posts...

To the original poster...

I would call a place in LA called the Camera House... one of the two places in LA who still work with the Viper... they have a post house... so they can work with the workflow as well... same deal $400 bucks a day...

There are two streams... video stream & film stream that the Viper can shoot... so do your research on that also...

Best to get your advice from those who worked with the camera... I only know bits & pieces... but we ended up not renting Vipers for a shoot...

One thing the adapter will do is soften the image... a film out will do the same thing...

 

[Steven Caesare]

Not "perhaps"... it really is, a day and night difference...

We use adapters to put beautiful dirt in the image... film is not so clean as RED is... it is totally subjective... I have DoP's over my shoulder when doing CC and they push me to put dirt in the image... they don't like the "clinical" super clean RED image...

We even filmrecord on camera negative to get the dirt...

So as an engineer I like the super clean... but artistically, DoP's don't like that...

Not a candle... have you ever tried to pull the sat curve on red/yellow in a low light scene to lift the skin tone with footage from RED and Viper to see the difference?

Yes, Andrew you are right the 1.33 anamorphic's would work...

But I still prefer the DigiPrimes route... but again is aesthetics... as I said above, the dirt and the anamorphic artifacts is what we are after...

Are you telling me the artifacting visible in the Viper pics you posted in post #26 of this thread are desirable and you use lenses to introduce those on purpose?

Preferring some grain or the "warmth" of a particular lens I understand. That's neither.

-sc

 

[Andrew McCarrick]

I don't have time to read all the posts...

To the original poster...

I would call a place in LA called the Camera House... one of the two places in LA who still work with the Viper... they have a post house... so they can work with the workflow as well... same deal $400 bucks a day...

There are two streams... video stream & film stream that the Viper can shoot... so do your research on that also...

Best to get your advice from those who worked with the camera... I only know bits & pieces... but we ended up not renting Vipers for a shoot...

One thing the adapter will do is soften the image... a film out will do the same thing...

Actually The Camera House is the place I found it for 400 a day.

But now doing a price comparison it's looking like RED might be cheaper... The 800 is only Camera Body and Recorder... I'd have to add all the accessories (tripods, matte boxes, follow focus, ect.), which I could get from a Zacuto package minus the camera body; but that pushes the costs above a RED rental from Indie Rentals.


How common is it for rental houses to do student discounts?

And does anybody know where to rent 1.33x anamorphics?

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

Are you telling me the artifacting visible in the Viper pics you posted in post #26 of this thread are desirable and you use lenses to introduce those on purpose?

Preferring some grain or the "warmth" of a particular lens I understand. That's neither.

-sc

hoper edei deixai... or in ancient Greek "ὅπερ ἔδει δεῖξαι"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q.E.D.