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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

IBC 2009 ¿Where is the Scarlet?

There are some advantages to 2/3" -- I'm shooting right now on a 35mm digital camera (Genesis) for a TV series and find that I can really see how the focus pullers are struggling with the depth of field at f/2.8 stop, so when possible, I try to give them something closer to an f/4 just to speed things along (doing fewer takes due to focus).

When I shoot on a 2/3" camera, I tend to light closer to an f/2.0-2.8 split to reduce the depth of field closer to what I'd get at an f/5.6 in 35mm. So I then have the advantages of being able to use smaller zooms that open to an f/2.0 (rare in 35mm cine), being able to light to lower levels, and yet have enough depth of field to make focus-pulling easier. Of course, aesthetically, I still prefer the look of 35mm at near f/2.8 in terms of the focus dropping off around the actors, but from a practical standpoint of working fast on zooms in minimal light levels and having a workable depth of field, there are some advantages to using a 2/3" camera.
 
Funniest post I've read all day... Yeah, I'm really going to not buy a camera that does 3K REDCODE at 120 fps because there's another camera on the market that does soft 1080p at 30p and distorts like hell whenever you pan...
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A few facts. 7D shoots 24p native. Motion artifacts are greatly improved... and the big one... it's a camera you can actually purchase. Let us know when you start shooting 3k REDCODE at 120 fps with your Scarlet.
 
zane smithe said:
A few facts. 7D shoots 24p native. Motion artifacts are greatly improved... and the big one... it's a camera you can actually purchase. Let us know when you start shooting 3k REDCODE at 120 fps with your Scarlet.
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But still, when Scarlet is released, the most that's going to change is that they might have got a bit closer to the resolution of 1080p and maybe they will be able to shoot 60p at the very best... The 2/3" fixed Scarlet will still be in a different league.
 
By the time Scarlet is released I'm guessing Canon will drop the bomb. People suggesting that Canon can't do it only Red can are just speculating...as I am. Canon have been around for a long time and who knows what they have up their sleeve?
 
I agree that 2/3" is actually a pretty good compromise for every day video. You have a bit more DOF control than the 1/3" cameras but probably not so much that focusing is a pain. The best thing is the chip is bigger so chances are it will be more sensitive than existing video cameras. The trend in consumer cameras these days seems to be not so much megapixels anymore but better image quality in low light.

But competition for the fixed lens 2/3" Scarlet could come from the digital camera companies if they decide to resurrect that sensor size again and add HD video with full autofocus and all the other goodies then price it at say $2000 for a pro model and less than $1000 for a consumer HV20 type model. I could see something like that taking over the low-budget HV20 type crowd. You can see how small a camera like this can get by looking at the old Canon Pro1 from 2004. This camera had a 2/3" sensor with a 28-200mm f/2.4-3.5 lens and weighed 1.4 lbs.

specsview.jpg


Of course, Scarlet will have REDCODE, 120 fps, professional features, module compatibility and maybe even some surprises, but a lot of people (especially soccer moms) might be convinced by price, weight and size to go with something simpler from Canon or Nikon. Olympus and Panasonic seem committed to micro 4/3 and who knows what Sony will do.
 
Russ Blaise said:
Many are going nuts over at the Scarletuser.com forum. Someone posted that the 2/3 fixed scarlet was canned:

http://www.scarletuser.com/showthread.php?t=3468

Planet Earth has left the solar system :willy_nilly:
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Hilarious... I don't see how anyone reading this thread could get that impression - given that it was some random who said it, and then Graeme comes in right in the next reply and calls BS...
 
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I was out shooting jets for 6 hours today and I have to say I prefer having a rig on my shoulder. 3 guys next to me were using Digital 35mm type handhelds and kept missing shots ( 2 were vocal about it) I think they were shooting stills only. I didn't really pay attention to their gear as I was there for my own footage so no time for chit chatting. I ended up with 3 hours total so I hope I get a few money shots in there. Any extra funds will still go into my Scarlet fund. Take your time RED guys as I'd rather have a working camera. Those still saving up for one should just be happy they will have more $ saved up so they can get a better version of the Scarlet. I know some can't wait so go buy another camera and start shooting. Some may have to use the money they saved to pay bills. You do what you have to do and should live each day. I did not want to shoot today because I've had a long week and no sleep so sleeping in BED all day was what I really wanted to do today. But I had to take 4 hours sleep and go work. I wished I had a good nights sleep and a Scarlet but I live in the real world. The Scarlet is not ready and the F-22 was going to Guam tonight. When I use the shot in my movie most people will not ask what the F-22 was shot with. I hope they will be thinking " That's F'n cool ". Well I'm off to transfer some footage. Tired but worth it. If I had stayed in bed waiting for a Scarlet I would have nothing. But I am looking forward to the day when I'm out rested with a Scarlet rig having fun. Gives you something to look forward too : ) I'm an old guy (wink) so even if the Scarlet came out in 6 months it would still seem like 6 weeks to me, Time just flies by these days. To kill it I'm sure some of these uppity filmmakers who's films are hold pending the release of the Scarlet could use the time to polish a few pages or shoot a video edit on DV to see if your idea is even something worth spending money on. My copy of DV mag had a story about the Pani DMC-GH1 used for a feature on the cover. The iPod nano feature film will be next. Scarlet will have it's day too. In the end it's still the script and skill of the filmmaker that counts ( plus those magic moments when everything clicks).
 
David Mullen summed it up perfectly, and I think it's very important for future Scarlet owners to be aware of the differences between 2/3 and 35mm. Saying 2/3 has become irrelevant is such a misunderstanding of the available technology. There are times when my R1 is absolutely useless to me because a shooting situation calls for a different type of camera. To understand why 35mm sized sensors may not always be the best option, I highly suggest shooting with one in low light, with your lens opened all the way and trying to pull your own focus while following/tracking your subject. The test - you can't lose focus at any time. It has to be right on. Can you do it?

Scarlet 2/3 is going to be a great camera and will be appropriate for a lot of different shooting scenarios. The FF Scarlet will also be great, especially for cinematic projects that have the crew, the lighting, etc and allow filmmakers to control the entire frame at all times.
 
Scarlet 2/3"

Scarlet 2/3"

Saying 2/3 has become irrelevant is such a misunderstanding of the available technology.
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Very true, and even if all Scarlet 2/3" did was offer images equal to an F900 and frame rates twice that of a Varicam ...

let alone with the pricing and other advanced feature advantages.... you would still expect it to be a major hit.
 
John Caballero said:
Don't worry, RAW video from other manufacturers is coming. You can bet on that. It is called competition and is going to be a fierce one at that in the next couple of years.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-10349300-264.html?tag=newsLatestHeadlinesArea.0
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Just because there is an open format RAW codec available for video, doesn't mean Canon and Nikon DSLR's can write raw files at full motiion frame rates. This still requires a data pipeline and sensor/A/D processor speeds good enough to handle the data rates required, even if storage is off camera. Notice that none of the big players have signed on to the standard.
 
I can't believe that anyone would think that Red 2/3" is "canned." That camera is going to kick ass up and down the block. Think of the tens of thousands of BMXers and skateboarders, for example, who will use the 120fps. Think of all the wildlife shooters who are going to be stoked on this tiny camera that shoot RAW 120fps with massive magnification factors on most glass. I could go on and on.
 
I keep looking for other Cameras that can do what the 2/3 fixed says it can do and there really isn't anything out there… Well there is but you'lll pay a hefty price for it .

Here is a part of an email I received from RED (March 2009) after I emailed them a question about the 2/3 fixed:

"Thank you so much for your email and interest in RED. The Scarlet 2/3 complete kit includes power, finder and media module." - Chaia Benes

Media Module: So I wonder what all that will add as far as features like sound and so on?
 
Jim's smart enough to know that all 10 people threatening to not buy red if there demands are not met is not going to effect his bottom line, fact is once fixed scarlet comes out it will sell crazy amounts.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
I think they mean a CF card reader. Media meaning what type of media the footage will be formated to.
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So then it looks like for sound you would need the "Pro Cinema I/O Module". I'd sure like to know what that puppy is going to cost...
 
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