A Digital Loader is not a DIT

[hoylecd]

The use of DIT to describe a Digital Loader is becoming far to prevalent. These two positions need to be separated, because as the transition from film to digital becomes more wide spread, the need for a Digital Loader will become in ever increasing demand. Let's first break down exactly what these two different jobs are.

A DIT (Digital Imaging Technician) is focused on color. They primarily work in HD environments and their responsibilities include matching multiple cameras or "painting the cameras" using tools like vector scopes to accurately see what the camera is recording. They work with the D.P. to make sure every shot isn't being blown out or is too dark to assure the best footage is being handed to post.

A Digital Loader is focused on data. They make sure that every piece of media is safely and securely stored. They use tools like computers, RAIDs, LTO decks, etc. to protect data as well as quality check footage, render media, and work closely with post on a solid workflow.

Of course, this is a brief description of both, but the important distinction here is that a DIT is focused on color, and Digital Loader is focused on data. So why are so many Digital Loaders calling themselves DITs?

One reason, the position of Digital Loader is so new that there currently isn't a union position to define it. As of now, there are many different titles used to describe the same position. This includes Digital Loader, Digital Asset Manager, Data Capture Engineer, Digital Management Tech and Data Wrangler among others. While I personally prefer Digital Loader, any of the other terms I listed would work just fine. DIT however, does not describe this position, and since it is already a well defined job, I believe a need to separate the two is essential.

As the transition from film to digital productions speeds up, a need to determine a common title for this position is necessary. A clear definition of job responsibilities and pay grade also need to be worked out. The fact that both Local 600 and 695 unions are vying for this position doesn't help.

With so many variables up in the air, the one thing I do know is this. The position of DIT already exists and does not have anything to do with data management. While I'm sure many will disagree, or argue that the term DIT has simply evolved, the traditional DIT still exists and is used on productions. And because of this, the person who manages data needs a different title. I am interested to see how others feel about this topic, and what title (Digital Loader, Data Capture Engineer, Data Wrangler, etc.) should be used.

 

[Alex Carr]

You are right, The two are very different.

A Digi-loader should be able to move up to AC.

 

[Tobias Straka]

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16252&highlight=dit

One thing is important I think: A DIT should not focus on color too much (look-wise; we're shooting RAW) but on advising the dp on how to expose the image the best way possible.

 

[Curtis Abbott]

On smaller productions couldn't this be the same person? I have been filling both descriptions; checking false color in RAW, working with the dp, transferring data and backing up, doing a first light in redcine to verify image quality.

Am I right in thinking this, or way off?

 

[hoylecd]

On smaller productions couldn't this be the same person? I have been filling both descriptions; checking false color in RAW, working with the dp, transferring data and backing up, doing a first light in redcine to verify image quality.

Am I right in thinking this, or way off?

This is a good point. Many argue that there isn't a need for a DIT with the RED ONE because it's shooting raw, and I have yet to work on a RED production that had one. In your case I've heard people call themselves a Red Tech, which seems to imply a combination of basic DIT work and basic Digital Loader work. And certainly on smaller shoots this sort of combination isn't uncommon.

What's important here is that you not simply label yourself a DIT. I think as RAW shoots become more prevalent the need for a DIT will become less important, and the camera department will revert to a more traditional hierarchy (D.P., Operator, 1st, 2nd, Digital Loader).

 

[Pietro Impagliazzo]

How come the need for a DIT will become less common because of RAW?

Unless the DP knows everything about the RED, because you can fuck up pretty well not knowing how to expose properly with the Mysterium and what not.

Do DPs need Image Technicians for film shoots? I never heard of it.

Now... With a new gen of DPs being educated in the digital cinema reality don't you think he'll know everything a DIT should?

So in this case yes... If the DP is well familiar with the digital world, he won't need a DIT, because he'll be one as well.

 

[Alexis Hanawalt]

I generally agree, and I generally accept any title I'm given. It's usually either DIT or "Red Tech." The latter seems more appropriate but 1st ACs will eventually know and understand the camera well enough that the notion needing to have someone standing by to answer questions about it will evaporate. The footage offloading aspect, however, will always exist - and it should be added that this position was already common on shoots involving P2 cards.

I feel that it's an assistant editor position. I've done a lot of assistant editing, and what I do on set when I'm offloading, transcoding, syncing and backing up is no different than what I would do if I were stepping in to something that's already in post. The processes involved have nothing to do with the training and skill involved in being a film loader.

 

[sander kamp]

Let's wait and see. People are learning and technology is changing. One reason to have a digital loader on the set is to make sure everything is backed up safely. But suppose next year we have solid state memory big enough to shoot an entire day on and the camera (Epic or Scarlet) provides tools to properly check your footage (such as 1080p out, fast navigating with thumbnails and iphone tagging of shots) then what does the digital loader do?

Personally I don't really care what I am called. People who do this job have different skills and you need to be aware of that when you hire somebody.

 

[Nick Gardner]

Unless the DP knows everything about the RED, because you can fuck up pretty well not knowing how to expose properly with the Mysterium and what not.

If you can't expose properly on any camera system without help, you have no right to charge people money as a DP. Exposure, and lighting ratios are what makes one a DP. Whether you use math, or go by eye or feel, lighting a scene is at the center of the job. I have had the discussion of what are dits for with many fellow DPs, and we all take great offense when some dit makes an issue of how we are exposing a scene.

Protecting highlights is a great concept, but whether it's film, varicam, or Red, sometimes you want shit to burn out. Having some doofus come screaming at you in front of the producer that you are clipping the sky is not helpfull. At the risk of offending dits, many of them inflate the level of their responsibility, and try to exert more control than they have. Black shading 3 or 4 times a day is not necessary, but I see it done all the time. They try to build mystery into their job so that they are perceived as essential.

As a Dp, if I have the choice between a dit and an extra grip, or a dit and an extra 6k, i'll lose the dit every time. Give me a good loader, that can back up data responsibly, fill out my time card, and cover the second when necessary any day of the week.

That's just my opinion, mileage may vary,

Nick

 

[Mark L. Pederson]

The position of DIT already exists and does not have anything to do with data management. While I'm sure many will disagree, or argue that the term DIT has simply evolved, the traditional DIT still exists and is used on productions. And because of this, the person who manages data needs a different title. I am interested to see how others feel about this topic, and what title (Digital Loader, Data Capture Engineer, Data Wrangler, etc.) should be used.

Local 600 ACs can "load" and "un-load" digital magazines.

It only falls to DIT classification if the IMAGE IS MANIPULATED, LUTS/LOOKS created, etc.

Words like "managed" and "wrangled" are pretty damn vague - and they lead the all the debate happening now.

My opinion:

DATA = FILM = CAMERA DEPARTMENT

LOAD, UNLOAD, COPY = AC or DIT

LUTS/LOOKS, COLOR/IMAGE PROCESSING (on set dailies, etc.) = DIT

I also think it's a SHAME that local 700 and local 600 are not working more closely together. This should all be about the crew members, not politics.

 

[Pietro Impagliazzo]

If you can't expose properly on any camera system without help, you have no right to charge people money as a DP. Exposure, and lighting ratios are what makes one a DP. Whether you use math, or go by eye or feel, lighting a scene is at the center of the job. I have had the discussion of what are dits for with many fellow DPs, and we all take great offense when some dit makes an issue of how we are exposing a scene.

Protecting highlights is a great concept, but whether it's film, varicam, or Red, sometimes you want shit to burn out. Having some doofus come screaming at you in front of the producer that you are clipping the sky is not helpfull. At the risk of offending dits, many of them inflate the level of their responsibility, and try to exert more control than they have. Black shading 3 or 4 times a day is not necessary, but I see it done all the time. They try to build mystery into their job so that they are perceived as essential.

As a Dp, if I have the choice between a dit and an extra grip, or a dit and an extra 6k, i'll lose the dit every time. Give me a good loader, that can back up data responsibly, fill out my time card, and cover the second when necessary any day of the week.

That's just my opinion, mileage may vary,

Nick

I'm talking about caveats... Color temp the sensor works best, rating the camera at higher ISOs in order to capture more highlight info etc.

A great DP that worked ages with film can pick up a R1 and fuck these things up.

But if the guy is a great DP and knows the R1 front back he's being both DP and DIT.

That was my point.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure we are speaking the same thing here, hehe.

 

[sander kamp]

Protecting highlights is a great concept, but whether it's film, varicam, or Red, sometimes you want shit to burn out. Having some doofus come screaming at you in front of the producer that you are clipping the sky is not helpfull. At the risk of offending dits, many of them inflate the level of their responsibility, and try to exert more control than they have. Black shading 3 or 4 times a day is not necessary, but I see it done all the time. They try to build mystery into their job so that they are perceived as essential.

I have been a lot on the job as a RED technician last year and mostly agree. If a DP has experience with RED and knows what he is doing then I leave him alone, unless I see something strange in the footage, in which case I will notify him.

One case though where I do feel it gets difficult is in low light situations. Somehow the RED LCD and viewfinder show a nicer image than you see back on the computer. In low light the monitors of the camera seem brighter than they are and the histograms can be tricked by bright spots in the image so it is difficult to judge how much noise there will be in the end. In those situations I feel it is necessary to warn that it is going to be noisy or costly in post.

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

As I see it, there is a need in the close circle of the producer for a new position... I call it DpE or Digital production Engineer. is the guy that sits with the producer, director and DoP together and plan the production he has the full responsibility from start to end that is pre-production to final first copy on film or digital (in any form, web, DVD, Bleuray etc) and archiving.

This new position in the food chain has to have a degree in electronics engineering and at least four years experience in post and another two years in a modern DI environment in order to master the color management technics and lastly to have a experience on the set in any position of at least one year. Of coarse he have to master the camera system that will be in use and be able to consult the DoP and on the same time stay invisible on the set. So to be a DpE you will need similar amount of time that a DoP needs from being a simple 2AC to be a DoP.

The DpE will choose his assistance that will be Data wranglers data loaders etc.

This new role is needed in order to get on his shoulders the pure technical load that the new systems are introducing to the creative chain of Producer-Director-DoP.

Just imagine if there is any chance, a classic film oriented producer to shoot a film with a digital camera and have C. Gavras as a director and Storaro as a DoP... there is no way these people to do a film with RED, without a DpE.-

When we will have this kind of support in the digital productions, we will eliminate the "nervous producer syndrome"

 

[Jonathan Smiles]

As I see it, there is a need in the close circle of the producer for a new position... I call it DpE or Digital production Engineer. is the guy that sits with the producer, director and DoP together and plan the production he has the full responsibility from start to end that is pre-production to final first copy on film or digital (in any form, web, DVD, Bleuray etc) and archiving.

You basically just described what I do.

On my current production I am both RED Camera Supervisor and Post Production Supervisor.

 

[el_diablo]

Yes...both film expirienced as well a Digital expirienced DOPs can make trouble with RED cam, especialy in low light. We had a plethora of 20% exposed faces of people in last few months comming from both sides of DOP spectra.

 

[Mark Pugh]

I think productions are just better off hiring DPs that know what they are doing.

 

[Liam Hall]

I think productions are just better off hiring DPs that know what they are doing.

New technology always takes a bit of bedding in. I remember when Avid first hit the streets, quickly followed by a bunch of computer nerds claiming they were editors, getting gigs because they could operate an Avid.

It was cool, I got paid to do quite a lot of re-edits

As a director, I'd rather have a DoP who can light and frame brilliantly rather than one who only knows his way around the camera. Of course, I'd rather have both and I'm sure after a couple of years that's exactly how it will be.

 

[Evangelos Achillopoulos]

As a director, I'd rather have a DoP who can light and frame brilliantly rather than one who only knows his way around the camera. Of course, I'd rather have both and I'm sure after a couple of years that's exactly how it will be.

Exactly Liam...

A DoP is primarily an artist that has to put his full effort in the the art of Cinematography and not in the bits and pieces of an LTO backup system or a LUT or a denoise process in post... in general the digital madness of this digital era...

He has to focus on his job, art that is... the rest is for a engineer and his assistance to handle...

Disclaimer: I believe the DpE is needed only in the case of a full length feature film or a big production. The small one day or two spec ads, the RED owner with a data wrangler are enough...

 

[Nick Gardner]

He has to focus on his job, art that is... the rest is for a engineer and his assistance to handle...

This is true to a point. A DP should know all about the effects of pushing stocks, bleach bypass, cross processing, shooting reversal, flashing and more. Thats a lot more complicated than reading a histogram, and exposing in low light, and they should shoot tests if they are not sure. It's our job to understand the technology.

Nick

 

[A. Clint Litton]

I definitely get what Nick is saying, and whenever in doubt--whatever the technology may be--I think many would agree it's best to test in order to get a feel for how you can go about accomplishing your goals. That said, there are DPs who have a great eye and instinct that have had some tough spells with the Red, I think in part due to so much *talk* about what it can do, especially on the low end. I'm not saying they should be let off the hook for underexposing and thinking (not knowing...by way of testing) they'd be fine considering how much they could pull out of the depths without incurring the wrath of blue noise...but I'm sure we all have had our misconceptions about the camera and how it would perform based on what people post here versus how it does perform.

Furthermore, a Red Tech (or whatever you want to call it) who does understand the camera, exposure, etc. can be of great aid to a DP who hasn't cut his or her teeth on the system enough to know its intricacies for themselves. This seems to me to be beyond the simple categorization of what a data wrangler or loader does on-set.

From what I can tell from these boards and from my own experience, the duties assigned to the individual on a Red job who's been given the title of DIT etc will vary widely based on his or her experience and what they can confidently (or rather, competently) do for a production. As Alex mentioned, some of it is as much post-related as it is camera-related. No matter how the unions eventually define the position, there's no doubt in my mind that people will need to pull from many different areas of expertise in order to do the job well.

From where I stand, the most significant and important duties to be performed by this person, no matter the title, are:

- to see that things run as smoothly and efficiently with the camera as possible,
- that footage is safely handled and backed-up,
- that any foreseeable problems related to the camera or firmware builds or post-workflows are conveyed to production as early as possible so that workarounds can be effected (being able to suggest to save production time and/or money is another useful tool in the kit)

...all so that the people hiring the camera & associated crew come away from the experience feeling satisfied that they chose Red over some other capture medium.

Maybe it's early yet, but I think there could be multiple jobs to be defined from this broad range of duties and tasks performed, and it won't surprise me if it's continually difficult to pin down. I do agree that DIT is not the best title in the traditional sense, but I don't typically ask people to change that title on the call sheet, either.

In any case, it's a brave new world, and I'm excited to be a part of it.

Cheers,
Clint

DP / Red Tech