Important

[Ronnie Wenngren]

If a used RED One are sold at almost the same price as a new one - why buy the used one????
Naturally have the camera been changed and improved during these two years. Therefore a camera from -07 can´t have the same price as a new one. Impossible.
I also think this crazy prices for used cameras destroys the market. Of course you can refund it for new RED models but I still think we must be fair to each other. And most important: What have been changed since #1?
I would like a complete list of improvements made inside the camera from #1 until today. Naturally these improvments are worth money - and lowers the price of early cameras.
RED should make a thread about this.

And when you buy a used one you don´t even know if you are getting one of those cameras with the rebooting problems - read other threads.

/Ronnie

 

[Seth Larney]

If a used RED One are sold at almost the same price as a new one - why buy the used one????
Naturally have the camera been changed and improved during these two years. Therefore a camera from -07 can´t have the same price as a new one. Impossible.
I also think this crazy prices for used cameras destroys the market. Of course you can refund it for new RED models but I still think we must be fair to each other. And most important: What have been changed since #1?
I would like a complete list of improvements made inside the camera from #1 until today. Naturally these improvments are worth money - and lowers the price of early cameras.
RED should make a thread about this.

And when you buy a used one you don´t even know if you are getting one of those cameras with the rebooting problems - read other threads.

/Ronnie

As far as I am aware, every change that has been made hardware-wise to the RED ONE has been made available as upgrades to all the cameras. So all REDs shipped since day one should be identical hardware-wise to the current shipping units (if upgraded properly).

The rest is done via firmware upgrades, which all RED's have access to as well.

 

[Ronnie Wenngren]

Thanks for fast answer.
So everyone do this hardware updates? Or only almost everyone?
How many hardware updates have been announced since the beginning?
If you are a Red owner and have made certain hardware updates - isn´t that important to mention when you sell a used camera?
Are hardware updates which doesn´t have to do with the CMOS-sensor for free? Shipping cost only?

/Ronnie

 

[Seth Larney]

All updates have been for free *including shipping which is paid by RED!*

So it would seem that even if someone hasn't done the updates (audio board upgrade etc). Then the new owner could still send it in for the free upgrade.

Correct me if I'm wrong someone but I'm pretty sure that's the case.

 

[Ronnie Wenngren]

Thanks for very nice information.
So if you buy a camera with upgrades missing you just send it in for free.
Du you know how long time such a upgrade takes? I live in Sweden/Europe.
Several weeks?

/Ronnie

 

[Jens Jakob Thorsen]

All firmware/software updates are done by the user via the internet and using a CF or SD card.

JJ

 

[Ronnie Wenngren]

Yes, that I know, but I seem to have missed that there also were free hardware upgrades.

/Ronnie

 

[Seth Larney]

All firmware/software updates are done by the user via the internet and using a CF or SD card.

JJ

Correct, and if the serial number for the camera has been called for by RED for the adio board upgrade then you can send it to them at their cost for the upgrade to be done..when you are ready.

 

[Paul Cronin]

Ronnie not all are selling for the same price as new. Look at mine #5721 which is 12% discount on a camera that is only one month old and has all the upgrades. Plus discounted options.

 

[Sam Druckerman]

The camera's are NOT equal in value! The lower the # the faster you get New models (EPIC / SCARLET), new accessories, and all upgrades. The first 100 have a special designation, X..... like mine, 81X. Those first 100 RED's with an X are worth there weight in gold

RED has done a remarkable thing, keeping the RED customer line based on who was first to believe in RED. And by offering the full trade in upgrade, again RED has protected it's customer base, stabilized the used RED market and shown extraordinary loyalty to there customers!

So, the reality is, if your lucky enough to cut the REDline by buying a used one, you should be prepared to pay more, depending on how early the # is.

And people wonder why RED owners LOVE RED?

 

[Nicholas Shields]

Unless I'm missing something, "value" as it relates to serial #'s is moot when one considers that the ability to secure an early Epic/Scarlet is based on original ownership. Am I wrong? If so, my apologies.

 

[Zakaree Sandberg]

It is in order of serial#.. so if sam sells his camera.. whoever buys it, now has that number and is therefore bumped up on the line...

thus... it is not moot.

 

[Cüneyt Kaya]

It is in order of serial#.. so if sam sells his camera.. whoever buys it, now has that number and is therefore bumped up on the line...

thus... it is not moot.

but if serial nr. 70 did get his cam august 08 and serial nr. 1500 three months earlier....serial nr. 1500 is the first in line

 

[Seth Larney]

The camera's are NOT equal in value! The lower the # the faster you get New models (EPIC / SCARLET), new accessories, and all upgrades. The first 100 have a special designation, X..... like mine, 81X. Those first 100 RED's with an X are worth there weight in gold

RED has done a remarkable thing, keeping the RED customer line based on who was first to believe in RED. And by offering the full trade in upgrade, again RED has protected it's customer base, stabilized the used RED market and shown extraordinary loyalty to there customers!

So, the reality is, if your lucky enough to cut the REDline by buying a used one, you should be prepared to pay more, depending on how early the # is.

And people wonder why RED owners LOVE RED?

This is true, I was answering purely the "what upgrades have been made to the camera" part of the OP's question

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

I am willing to pay a sizable premium for sub 100 only...$5000. a modest premium for sub 250 ($2500) and Id pay even money on a sub 500... but beyond that...

I would rather buy new one and wait because... or a higher number at a discount...

Shawn Nelson here in Portland is number 27 anyway, and I want that fine young man him to make his $ back.


after first 500 (which it sure seems most of the early guys are rental houses) I think the rental advantage is over, and I seriously doubt RED is going to ship this next wave of cameras as slowly as they did the RED ONE...

and even a year to get caught up isnt that bad...

Aside from learning a ton on HOW to make them better, I trust they have also learned how to manage production schedules and will now under promise and over deliver...

Especially as they are also building a RANCH facility to accommodate production...

and I trust Scarlett Fixed lens orders will be 5 to 10 times RED ONE.

I dont want one early for rental... I just want the lighter, stronger, faster BAD ASS looking new one...

Actually 2... one for Scarlett Brains 1 for EPIC Brains... and I expect to own ALL the brains... allah willing.

Right now, Pauls 5271 is a GREAT deal versus new... as its under warranty, has the audio board and is PRISTINE... and a fair discount. Its less than a month old.

Others I have seen are pretty beat up... the BODY regardless should hold value for trade... but the accessories... they are already dropping... a ton.

and after Mark Pederson's sneak peak post?

All I want is a body with a nikon mount and Ill rent the aks...

so anybody with sub 100 that has 2 or more and wants to make $5K...on a BODY... please PM me.

cheers

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The first 100 cameras or so were swapped out by RED when there was an upgraded OLPF and some other hardware changes.

Since then, the only hardware upgrades have been:
1> An upgraded CF module -- sent to people when they order their first 16GB cards, or when they call up and request it, or the camera gets sent in...

2> Updated audio board and /i data pin installation. All new cameras since sometime last October have all the current hardware. Upgrades to the new hardware are handled free by RED and they pay shipping. It's about a 4-day procedure, maybe a few days longer for those outside the USA or further away from the UK upgrade center.

When you transfer ownership of the camera, the warranty does not transfer. The serial number only transfers if RED is aware of the ownership transfer. For RED to approve the ownership transfer, a camera being sold must be sent in to RED for service and evaluation. They certify that the camera is in proper working order and then transfer ownership.

As someone else already pointed out, what really matters is the delivery date of your camera. Serial #25 is pretty much worthless if the owner waited until RED was shipping cameras in the #4000's before taking delivery. So people when buying a camera to get a better place in line for EPIC, should check the delivery date in addition to the serial number.

Used camera prices vary, but I think $15K seems to be pretty fair for a RED One body w/ CF module installed. After all, it's still worth $17.5K trade-in toward an EPIC someday and it allows the owner to buy EPIC-X with or without the trade-in credit.

That's nearly a 17% discount off of the new price for the camera body. Definitely fair, IMO.

I have seen used cameras sell for even more when outside the USA because the VAT and import costs are higher in other places. So anyone buying a new camera in that location would still end up paying more.

 

[Paul Leeming]

As someone else already pointed out, what really matters is the delivery date of your camera. Serial #25 is pretty much worthless if the owner waited until RED was shipping cameras in the #4000's before taking delivery. So people when buying a camera to get a better place in line for EPIC, should check the delivery date in addition to the serial number.

Jeff, I think this is incorrect. Although I can't find it I do remember a post where Jim stated explicitly that it was serial number that mattered, not delivery date. The early believers get that reward because they BELIEVED, not because they got the full money in to Red before someone else.

Can you imagine the second hand sales mess if Red were indeed going on delivery date for upgrading to Epic/Scarlet? Not from Red themselves as they know when each camera went out, but rather from all the confused potential buyers of second hand cameras to get ahead in the queue.

I'm ready to be corrected if someone can point to Jim's post detailing either scenario.

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

Jeff, I think this is incorrect. Although I can't find it I do remember a post where Jim stated explicitly that it was serial number that mattered, not delivery date. The early believers get that reward because they BELIEVED, not because they got the full money in to Red before someone else.

Can you imagine the second hand sales mess if Red were indeed going on delivery date for upgrading to Epic/Scarlet? Not from Red themselves as they know when each camera went out, but rather from all the confused potential buyers of second hand cameras to get ahead in the queue.

I'm ready to be corrected if someone can point to Jim's post detailing either scenario.

Cheers,

Paul

I will find the post as I asked this question a month ago.

EDIT: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=336631&postcount=4

And its not a confusing mess. Every serial number has an assigned delivery date... if its sold, that info is transfered...how is that a sales mess?

 

[K. Møller]

Tim, that post that you link to does not state anything about dates. On the contrary, it states that earlier serial numbers are more valuable.

When did people start thinking that the delivery dates mattered in regards to the EPIC-X upgrade program? I'm almost certain that is a mistake.

Ronnie, it took me ten days (over Christmas) to send my camera to L.A. and get it back. Highly effective if you ask me.
If I had sent it to London, I'm sure it would have been faster, even.

Cheers

Karuna

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

Tim, that post that you link to does not state anything about dates. On the contrary, it states that earlier serial numbers are more valuable.

When did people start thinking that the delivery dates mattered in regards to the EPIC-X upgrade program? I'm almost certain that is a mistake.

Ronnie, it took me ten days (over Christmas) to send my camera to L.A. and get it back. Highly effective if you ask me.
If I had sent it to London, I'm sure it would have been faster, even.

Cheers

Karuna

The previous post asked to show either scenario... my other comment was that its not really a mess, if it IS by delivery date... im sure most all sub 500 took delivery anyway... search is too broad right now... but I swear Jim made a comment somewhere that there were lots of deposits and orders that never took delivery... but it sounded like later orders... who knows?

Soooo... Do you want to sell me your # 224 body for a profit? seriously