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Confused Red Owner: Epic S35 vs Scarlet S35

J

Jason Ing

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First, bravo to Jim and the Red Team. Truly. :)

Okay... a little confused here. I tried reading around the threads and I keep going back to that camera comparison table that Jim posted last night.

Okay... so... is the main difference between upgrading to the Epic S35 or buying a Scarlet S35 just redcode 42 vs 225? (I know there's different accessories, etc.)

They use the same sensor and the same lenses, so the image quality is the same.

So next year, someone can buy a Scarlet S35 for 7k and get the same thing for my 17.5k Red One (I get a free upgrade to the Mysterium X, correct?).

Or, to put it another way, I can pay 10.5k more for the Epic S35 and get what I already have on my free, upgraded mysterium x Red One. What am I paying 10.5k more for? Am I paying for Redcode?

Anyway... maybe the point is sort of moot because I want the Epic FF35!!! My geeky techno nerd is coming out in me and I'm lusting after the 16bit, 13+ stops. I can see paying more for that because it means better image quality, right? Problem is I can't afford another 17.5k. :(

So maybe the real question for me is... how long is the upgrade offer good for? As long as I own it, hopefully?

But it sort of sucks because I'll be stuck with an older sensor while everyone has the new ones while I save up year after year.

But the silver lining is... my RED ONE ROCKS!!! haha. :)


P.S. Can Red One upgrade to Monstro?
 
No free sensor upgrades for Red One. I believe Jim has said before that you will be able to upgrade to X and Monstro, but at a price.
 
oh... misread that one. :(

thanks.

It's an exciting day and all... but as a Red One owner it somehow feels cloudy and grey for some reason.

Can someone shine some sun and explain to me how this is good for a Red One owner?
 
Jason Ing said:
oh... misread that one. :(

thanks.

It's an exciting day and all... but as a Red One owner it somehow feels cloudy and grey for some reason.

Can someone shine some sun and explain to me how this is good for a Red One owner?
Click to expand...

It's not... swim with the school or get eaten by walruses.
 
I at first was horrified about how much money I spent on something that is going to be replaced, but then I took comfort in the fact that I have my camera in hand and that all of these products probably wont be available until the end of next year.
 
Yes, true.

Maybe I'm taking this harder because I'm one of those birger mount suckers believing in Erik's "next week" crap. :)
 
Jason Ing said:
Can someone shine some sun and explain to me how this is good for a Red One owner?
Click to expand...

It's not, really. It's good for RED (which *is* good for us!) and it's good for the world. I'm happy for the company, who has treated us well. I'm happy for the future owners of the camera.

But seeing my 6-month old investment get undercut by the new SCARLET on the block just isn't any fun. I'm just not feeling the love, not if the love is going to cost me a lot more money, on top of my already considerable investment.

At the end of the day, I'm going to buy sensor upgrades for both of my RED ONES and gratefully accept the 12% discount and buy a pair of the cheapest possible SCARLETS and build myself a lightweight 3D rig. After being promised my "wildest dreams," it feels like a bit of a letdown.

As it turns out, I can't actually afford my wlldest dreams.

I think I expected to feel ecstatic, personally, and instead, after weighing the options, I feel more like, "Oh, that will be nice.
 
planet e said:
At the end of the day, I'm going to buy sensor upgrades for both of my RED ONES and gratefully accept the 12% discount and buy a pair of the cheapest possible SCARLETS and build myself a lightweight 3D rig. After being promised my "wildest dreams," it feels like a bit of a letdown.
Click to expand...

Sensor upgrade OR 12% discount.

I think it's an either or choice.

Or am I wrong?
 
Jason Ing said:
First, bravo to Jim and the Red Team. Truly. :)
Or, to put it another way, I can pay 10.5k more for the Epic S35 and get what I already have on my free, upgraded mysterium x Red One. What am I paying 10.5k more for? Am I paying for Redcode?
Click to expand...

the 10.5k upgrade is for BRAIN only!!! I assume that to get a fully functional decent upgrade you will have to buy the modules separately!!! So, that 10.5k will convert in 20k-25k to get a full blown Epic S35!!!
I personally will Go with the 12% discount upgrade to Scarlet!! BUT this 12% will be BRAIN ONLY or it will cover the NEW MUST BUY modules? Anyone from Red to clarify this?
 
Jason Ing said:
Sensor upgrade OR 12% discount.

I think it's an either or choice.

Or am I wrong?
Click to expand...

hmm, just went back and read it, and it is not entirely clear to me, just as it is not entirely clear from "SCARLET system purchase" whether the 12% applies to body only, or all parts...

I'm sure all will be clarified, in due course...
 
Jason and Planet e, I feel exactly the same way. Good for RED for accomplishing what they have, they're making the world a better place, but for young RED ONE owners like myself that blew their savings on the FIRST awesome RED product, no real good news for them. I can't afford to upgrade to an Epic, and I'm not sure I could afford to buy the FF35 Scarlet for a long while, even with the %12 trade in discount.

I guess I'll pay for the sensor upgrade, but todays news is much better for people who have not yet bought a camera and who's $12,000 Scarlet will out perform my $20,000+ upgraded RED ONE.
 
Jason Ing said:
...Can someone shine some sun and explain to me how this is good for a Red One owner?
Click to expand...

You have a REDONE now.
One of the best digital video-still cam on this planet. There will always be better stuff out there. These cams are months, maybe years out, and by that time maybe Canon, Panasonic or even Sony have gotten the idea and are making cams like this.

RED is not the holly grail.. but almost :)

Cheers
 
planet e said:
hmm, just went back and read it, and it is not entirely clear to me, just as it is not entirely clear from "SCARLET system purchase" whether the 12% applies to body only, or all parts...

I'm sure all will be clarified, in due course...
Click to expand...

"Once any of the above has been chosen, the serial number will be marked as "Executed". It can not be used again for #2 or #3. It can, however, always be eligible for another sensor upgrade as we release new sensor technology in the future."
 
gotcha, ok. my lightweight 3D rig just jumped 24% in price:sad: :unsure: ah, well....

so today, i learned that i can pay for a sensor upgrade (which I already knew). it is hard to get excited -- once again, hard to get excited personally, even though I think the program itself is really, really cool.
 
It's been proposed on another thread that than a possible upgrade path is to trade-in for a Scarlet S35/FF35 with credit.
 
Jason Ing said:
It's been proposed on another thread that than a possible upgrade path is to trade-in for a Scarlet S35/FF35 with credit.
Click to expand...

That doesn't sound unreasonable for a Red One beta-camera tester.
I for one always thought "all" parts of the R1 would be upgradeable, making obscele...etc, I felt a little misled when I realised that resolutions and fps from the original specs. had been compromised by lack of dsp power, not to mention the struggling codec, and then later to realise there's a lack of crucial upgradeability in these areas, unless you pay double for the Epic upgrade. Not being able to upgrade the processor in a technologically advanced and upgradeable product, marketed as "modular" and making obscelescense obselete etc, is frankly, still disappointing.
I don't feel a free sensor upgrade would be unreasonable for those who still suffer image anomolies, but then I'm greedy i guess and want more useable DR, but a new sensor wouldn't help the codec.
Waiting for the day I trust my R1s peformance, and for the audio upgrade. Hope Red achieves massive market penetration, and love the new gear, but it looks like obscelescense will be arriving much sooner than expected for the R1.. maybe its just my serial number 1912, or a fault, but sometimes I get a titanic sinking feeling..
Paying more to sort out existing problems won't feel like a reward to this Red user, my guess is that redcode42 would be more useful, along with a european service center like what Sony got
 
You missed this thread, Jim.

This was just posted by Jim:

The "electronic engines" are different between each of these camera models. That means there are format capability differences. For example, the RED ONE has 4K, 3K, 2K, 1080P (soon) and anamorphic format options. It does ramping, time-lapse, has 4 channel 24-bit audio, etc. Scarlet will NOT have the full flexibility of a RED ONE. EPIC has more capability and flexibility than the other two. It is one of the reasons that the Scarlet body is smaller than an EPIC.

Just so you can figure that into your planning.

Scarlet will have limited format options.

RED ONE has many format options.

EPIC has virtually unlimited format options.
 
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