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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Post Deal Killer

I can get you REAL-TIME output to ProRes from Scratch on a mobile vehicle, available on-set, in SoCal. One-lights, full grades, etc... are possible. This should satisfy your client's requirements.

That said, it sounds like your client needs to speak with someone that can explain to them how to workflow their Red footage to be _much_ quicker turnaround than a film > telecine pipeline. I can also do that for you.

Please send me an e-mail at jt(at)traktionfilms(dot)com


regards,

John T.
 
TeamWB said:
My biggest client is telling me that this post slowness is going to be a deal killer and they will just go back to film.
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We just finished shooting a national spot and we edited the spot on location while shooting....on a laptop. By the time we wrapped, the offline was finished. We onlined the spots the next day in 2K and later that night our client was watching a 1080P Blu-ray dub in the privacy of his home.

What exactly is the "post slowness" you talk about?
 
digitalfx said:
We just finished shooting a national spot and we edited the spot on location while shooting....on a laptop. By the time we wrapped, the offline was finished. We onlined the spots the next day in 2K and later that night our client was watching a 1080P Blu-ray dub in the privacy of his home.

What exactly is the "post slowness" you talk about?
Click to expand...

yeah!...
 
digitalfx said:
We just finished shooting a national spot and we edited the spot on location while shooting....on a laptop. By the time we wrapped, the offline was finished. We onlined the spots the next day in 2K and later that night our client was watching a 1080P Blu-ray dub in the privacy of his home.

What exactly is the "post slowness" you talk about?
Click to expand...

WOW. Ok it must be OE on their part then.

Can you lay out your post steps for me so I can let them know their editors are not doing it right?
 
TeamWB said:
Not a damn thing is wrong with film. I love film! But ..... I don't rent film cameras nor do I shoot on them anymore. So for me and my business it is a problem.
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I didn't think they really want to go back to film anyway. I agree with others that they are just putting extra pressure on you with that threat.
 
Steve Sanacore said:
I didn't think they really want to go back to film anyway. I agree with others that they are just putting extra pressure on you with that threat.
Click to expand...

I love being on the cutting edge of technology. But needing to have ALL the answers is taxing. I just want to shoot and have them do the rest. Guess I'll just keep dreaming. :umm:
 
I'll let Greg outline his exact workflow himself, if he wants to... I haven't had the luxury of editing on set yet (not enough time or man-power with me behind the camera). Usually it's offload for backup and move on...

But keep in mind, like has already been mentioned, you can do your rough cut with the QT pointers (proxies) immediately after shooting. Generate an XML in FCP and use a tool like Crimson Workflow to load that XML into Redcine for conform. Load your DPX or ProRes conform back into FCP, finalize your edit... To work with DPX sequences, take a look at GlueTools. Right now it's a must have for FCS users who want to go beyond ProRes 4:2:2.

On set or not, you can jump in and start your rough cut with the proxies. For commercials, you could probably have your rough cut done before you finish transcoding all files to ProRes out of RedRushes, then just re-link the project to the ProRes files and finish your edit.
 
I am out of the office, but to simplify the workflow;
We use R3D Data Manager to backup all the raw footage throughout the day as shot. From these copies we edited our offline using the quicktime proxies on a MBPro. Once the client approved the edit, we moved back to our facility and using Crimson we exported 2K DPX files and conformed the sequence in Discreet Smoke where we did the final grading as well.

The project was originally going to be shot on 35mm, but for budget and time reasons the client switched to Red. If we shot film the process would have added no less than 3-7 days to ship film, process, and telecine.
 
digitalfx said:
I am out of the office, but to simplify the workflow;
We use R3D Data Manager to backup all the raw footage throughout the day as shot. From these copies we edited our offline using the quicktime proxies on a MBPro. Once the client approved the edit, we moved back to our facility and using Crimson we exported 2K DPX files and conformed the sequence in Discreet Smoke where we did the final grading as well.

The project was originally going to be shot on 35mm, but for budget and time reasons the client switched to Red. If we shot film the process would have added no less than 3-7 days to ship film, process, and telecine.
Click to expand...

This is perfect. Digital and Jeff and everyone else ...... Thank You!
 
There are some gotchas with the quicktime proxies however, so in fairness to those who are trying to pass along workflow tips to post facilities, etc. I highly recommend that you do some testing to make sure they work for your situation/client/style of project.

I love cutting with the proxies because it is immediate. But not every project is straight cuts, 1 or two tracks of video, etc. You may want to have speed changes, filtering, compositing, mixed formats, etc. In that case, you should really do some testing to see if the proxies will work for you. Also, a lot is determined by how you will be finishing. Will it be inside FCP, Color, After Effects, Smoke, Scratch, Davinci, etc?

With a variety of combinations of software and hardware, it's not always easy to pinpoint where things may go wrong. If you get the wrong combo of FCP, Red QT componet, Redcine, etc you may run into problems.

My point in all of this is to not necessarily steer you away from proxies but to point out that it is incredibly important to know where you are going in terms of offline edit and finishing. You need a carefully laid out workflow to avoid mistakes, and to seamlessly get from proxies/transcoded files to a final product. Point in case is that some people have found the proxies will not play smoothly on their systems while others have no problems at all.

As with any format, there has to be a system in place to handle it, and you want that system to be as robust and bulletproof as possible.
 
stevesherrick said:
There are some gotchas with the quicktime proxies however, so in fairness to those who are trying to pass along workflow tips to post facilities, etc. I highly recommend that you do some testing to make sure they work for your situation/client/style of project.

I love cutting with the proxies because it is immediate. But not every project is straight cuts, 1 or two tracks of video, etc. You may want to have speed changes, filtering, compositing, mixed formats, etc. In that case, you should really do some testing to see if the proxies will work for you. Also, a lot is determined by how you will be finishing. Will it be inside FCP, Color, After Effects, Smoke, Scratch, Davinci, etc?

With a variety of combinations of software and hardware, it's not always easy to pinpoint where things may go wrong. If you get the wrong combo of FCP, Red QT componet, Redcine, etc you may run into problems.

My point in all of this is to not necessarily steer you away from proxies but to point out that it is incredibly important to know where you are going in terms of offline edit and finishing. You need a carefully laid out workflow to avoid mistakes, and to seamlessly get from proxies/transcoded files to a final product. Point in case is that some people have found the proxies will not play smoothly on their systems while others have no problems at all.

As with any format, there has to be a system in place to handle it, and you want that system to be as robust and bulletproof as possible.
Click to expand...

That is exactly what I am doing. I am testing for the best possible way for them to handle the RED footage. I am trying all kinds of different workflows for them and I will get them the top 2 or 3 that people are having success with.
 
Other ways to get editing quickly without the limitations of the proxies, if they have the systems to convert, is to create lower res (480p) transcodes from a 1/8th debayer in redrushes. This is very fast. Alternatively, its' possible to run the QT proxies through a converter to dump them into DV or HDV format or something on that level. This was broken for many people for a while when trying to use the proxies with Compressor, but I think the latest updates from Apple and RED fix this. I haven't tried it with the latest QT component.
 
You can get transcodes to DVCPro HD in 720p with 1/4 debayer quite fast and it's a great format for offline if you need to try out a few more things than hard cuts.
 
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