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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

REAL Adobe support may take time

Jay A. Kelley

Jay A. Kelley

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Because people see me as the "Premiere PC guy" with post in regard to RED, I thought I would point out something I am seeing, and offer some advice.

I'm seeing a lot of people jumpinig over to the PC camp to get on board and be ready for the new Premiere / AE plugin that RED is promising next week.

But what exactly are you getting ready for?

Do NOT misunderstand, I think the release of the plugin is going to be wonderful. But I also think (This will shock you) that right now FCP has had considerably more development with RED post than Adobe.

I'm just saying, why not wait and see what this Plugin really does before you spend thousands of dollars on a new system. For the plugin to be useable in a real-world post situation you will need the following:

Real time playback and basic transitions in realtime (like dizzolve)
SOUND SUPPORT, all four tracks
Some sort of LIVE output to a broadcast monitor via HD-SDI realtime
Support for deep color and color grading

Now Jim and the boys have been doing their level best to warn us that this plugin will be "the beginning" and they are getting faster in development. But this is a major laundry list and may take some time to do.

Please understand I am not telling anyone here this is not cool. I am saying it may not be what you expect... NEXT WEEK.

I'm sure RED is seeing the incredible excitement everyone is showing, and I am sure that will push development up a few notches in the priority list, but you will need to give them some time to get this thing to work with all the bells and whistles.

Right now, at this moment, FCP is still the most developed post system for the RED, and if you are looking to buy a machine, take the same attitude you would with production: Don't do anything based on what MIGHT happen later. Deal with what's in front of you today.

When the plugin comes out next week, we'll all have a better idea of where we are starting, and how far there is to go.

One thing I know for sure, it will be great.. Perhaps not today, or tomorrow, but soon, and for the rest of your life!

:)

Your bud

Jay
 
Right on, Jay!

This is a good reality check. I think some people are so happy about the Adobe support announcement that they're going to set their expectations too high. Of course, we'll have to see what features we actually get to play with in this initial release.
 
Just think of all the bugs we've been through. Plan on some bumps. But Adobe has an opportunity to impress a lot of people here.

You have to think this is the perfect run up to Scarlet for them. If they kick butt on timely RED support A LOT of those who get a Scarlet are going to bail on FCP. Sad for Apple a little... hopefully they have a whole rewrite happening no one knows about. Scarlet is setting up to be a huge market. And that marketplace will need the simplest workflow possible or RED will have a support nightmare on their hands. Adobe. They are big, bad and care about pro apps.
 
You know what's funny about that Joel? I bet Adobe has less to do with it's customers than most. They can afford to since they have such an open API.

RED doesn't need to work with Adobe.. Adobe response to everyone is the same "here's the keys to the software... Write whateve the hell you want and leave us alone!!"

:)

I'm being a little dramatic here.. For fun

Jay
 
You are probably dead on Jay. It may well take a little time but what the hell. Last week I didn't think we would see the SDK for another couple months.

After spending much of my time since NAB learning FCP I am not in a great hurry for PP but having CS3 production suite waiting in the wings is still a nice feeling.

One thing I know for sure, it will be great.. Perhaps not today, or tomorrow, but soon, and for the rest of your life!
Click to expand...

Adobe and Red
I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship.
 
Jay,

The sad thing is that *real* Adobe 4k support is called Cineform.

But all we seem to get from Red are cryptic answers that don't say whether the SDK allows Cineform to release an R3D to Prospect converter.

A simple yes or no is all I need to make plans for the immediate future.

-Thor
 
Thor... I stated clearly that the Alpha R3D SDK does not initially go back to the firewall, but that is on the roadmap. What we have provided allows every company to begin RED support. As with our firmware upgrades, more features will be added as we go along. I can't speak for Cineform or any other company. We have a plan and we are executing it. It is or job, and in our customer's best interests, to release an SDK, then add capability to it as quickly as we can (just like we have done with camera firmware releases). We have done, and continue to do... just that.

Is that less cryptic?

Jim
 
...or probably you have forget that PP Cs3 over MAC is QUICKTIME based :))


silvio bonomi
 
It will take some time. I agree. I'm also way thrilled because I don't have to invest in new hardware or software. I don't plan on it being 4k, I'll be glad if it's 1k as long as when I park the CTI it is high res. I'm hoping for 4k debayering in Ae, but again, whatever we get is a start, it'll only get better from there.
 
kinobairn said:
It will take some time. I agree. I'm also way thrilled because I don't have to invest in new hardware or software. I don't plan on it being 4k, I'll be glad if it's 1k as long as when I park the CTI it is high res. I'm hoping for 4k debayering in Ae, but again, whatever we get is a start, it'll only get better from there.
Click to expand...

I agree. It will be a HUGE improvement over what I have to go through right now: I normally have to wait a week to start editing what is then a 1080P file as my new "master". So I can only record 1 hour per week right now. (2 cameras). Now, I will be doing post in a couple of hours. I need sound badly, but I'll find a way more easily now. And in one week, we may have that too!
Life is getting much brighter. No new investment either, since I would NEVER buy an Apple under any imaginable circumstances. Can't wait to get started.
 
About sound:

Remember that in the PC world there are no Quicktime proxies with sound on them. So until the Premiere plugin supports sound, you either have to record it separatly, use a MAC, or have your talent learn sign language.

Happily, the sound fix is not far off.

learning sign would be cool

Jay
 
neathedo said:
Life is getting much brighter. No new investment either, since I would NEVER buy an Apple under any imaginable circumstances. Can't wait to get started.
Click to expand...

Wow. Limiting yourself much? I tend to go where the workflow works best. Often Mac, sometimes PC, I'd freaking cut neg on a stone table if it was going to be effective for the project...

But that's just me. And don't get me wrong, I'm as excited about Adobe support as the next bloke. ;)
 
We all need to remember who we're talking about. Adobe and Red, working together is a great combination.

Adobe is the leader when it comes to working with raw pictures.

Red is leading an imaging rebellion that most of us absolutely love.

Think about how many years photoshop has been improving, was it perfect at first? No, but give Adobe and Red some time together, and we'll have some incredibly easy workflows and options.

When Adobe support is released next week, think about the year that Apple had and did almost nothing with.
 
Jannard said:
Thor... I stated clearly that the Alpha R3D SDK does not initially go back to the firewall, but that is on the roadmap. What we have provided allows every company to begin RED support. As with our firmware upgrades, more features will be added as we go along. I can't speak for Cineform or any other company. We have a plan and we are executing it. It is or job, and in our customer's best interests, to release an SDK, then add capability to it as quickly as we can (just like we have done with camera firmware releases). We have done, and continue to do... just that.

Is that less cryptic?

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim,

Much less cryptic. I will plan accordingly.

Thank you for the SDK, and Adobe support.

-Thor
 
I don't think it's fair to discount Adobe's business model. While I am sure RED and Adobe have spoken, and they may be making plans for NATIVE support WITHIN PREMIER (By this I mean you install Premiere on your system and RED is already there). The truth is that Adobe's business model allows Companys like RED to just jump in and get what they need on their own.

This is all Adobe's doing. They are not putting up walls. They make it easy.

By the way... I have not had any info given to me on this, but what if RED were planning to approach this like HDCam, or DVCPro, or P2.

You know.. Native support within all major editors, and hardware acceleration within certain capture cards. They are pushing enough numbers, and they have the branding.. It could happen.. Jesus, would that be incredible

Jay
 
neathedo said:
I agree. It will be a HUGE improvement over what I have to go through right now: I normally have to wait a week to start editing what is then a 1080P file as my new "master". So I can only record 1 hour per week right now. (2 cameras).
Click to expand...

7 Days to transcode out 2 hours of footage? That's insane. What kind of computer (processor speed) are you using???
 
Jay A. Kelley said:
This is all Adobe's doing. They are not putting up walls. They make it easy.

Jay
Click to expand...

I imagine Adobe has been doing more than just being easy to work with. This is important to Adobe just like it's important to Red. Premiere can handle the resolution and the bit depth, Premiere works the best with Ae, Premiere has Encore and Blu-ray support, Adobe has the ability to get us from shooting to Blu-ray rather painlessly.
 
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