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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

MC 2.8 to MC 3

M

Marcus Vasques Osorio

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Currently working on a project cut in MC 2.8 (filmed on RED of course). was wondering if the same project can somehow be imported into to MC 3 when it is released and the XML for REDCINE exported. Reason I ask is the offline will be finishing around the time that MC 3 is released and most probably purchased by the company I work with

mahvo
 
mahvo said:
Currently working on a project cut in MC 2.8 (filmed on RED of course). was wondering if the same project can somehow be imported into to MC 3 when it is released and the XML for REDCINE exported. Reason I ask is the offline will be finishing around the time that MC 3 is released and most probably purchased by the company I work with

mahvo
Click to expand...

Yes. The software is backward compatible.
But that's not relevant for the XML export.

The XML will be exported using the next version of FilmScribe which is bundled with Media Composer 3.0.

In FilmScribe you will open an Avid bin and select a sequence to export the XML.
Then you will have a "raw" XML file that needs to be formatted to a Redcine Pull List by using a droplet.


Please chime in MichaelP...
Since you wrote the darn thing :)
 
There are times when I wish I did write code, but I am not an engineer. By day I am a workflow/product designer and by night a filmmaker... :) It is a left brain/right brain battle on a constant basis!

Actually I did make my first transform last night using this drag and drop GUI that makes transforms to see how that would work. I still have a long way to go! I was able to pull a list of timecodes... it's a start!

But you are correct - except for semantics depending on which way you look at it. Projects and media will be forward compatible meaning you will be able to move forward from 2.8.x to 3. Keep in mind that on Mac it will be Leopard only. But Rebusfilm is also correct in that the XML is generated from FilmScribe which opens bins so you don't need to move your whole project to v3, just open the bin and generate the XML. Upgrade to v3 for all the other reasons... ;)

But... there is always a "but". The RedCine XML pull list is dependent on the values of the original clip length of the R3D file - in the RedCine XML to ALE file we preserve this as additional metadata to make sure it does not get truncated via consolidation or decompose processes. If you have not done this, then an XLST transform (you can "google" that term) can be created to use the original START/END and it would work. Moving forward, the XSLT file will look to the metadata for the pull list metadata and then to the START/END for the conform.

I hope that makes sense.

Michael
 
Also, related to the Transforms and FilmScribe.... The plan is to host a download area on avid.com that has all the XSLT Transforms that are created so users can download and use as needed. Any new ones that get created and are willing to share can also upload with a short description of what it does. FilmScribe will ship with a good handful of useful ones, but since these are fairly straightforward to make, news one will be made faster than the updates to the application itself, thus the "landing page" for FilmScribe. So keep an eye out for that one.

Some of the transforms I have been playing with are XML to storyboard, XML to CSV file, XML to locators w/text, XML to CMX3600, XML to Redcine pull list, XML to EDL Change list, etc.

Also, the XML and schema in a draft v1 form has been sent to many manufacturers already for them to parse the extensive metadata being tracked themselves so the process would be to just hand over the XML (as in an XML to Film Scan file format, etc.

Michael
 
Thanks for the heads up. We're kind of driving blindfolded for a couple of months until the software ships. Now and then we need someone to shout "left" or "right" to keep us on track...
 
MichaelP said:
But... there is always a "but". The RedCine XML pull list is dependent on the values of the original clip length of the R3D file - in the RedCine XML to ALE file we preserve this as additional metadata to make sure it does not get truncated via consolidation or decompose processes. If you have not done this, then an XLST transform (you can "google" that term) can be created to use the original START/END and it would work. Moving forward, the XSLT fie will look to the metadata for the pull list metadata and then to the START/END for the conform.

Michael
Click to expand...
Do we need to update any metadata from the Metacheater ALE for the Pull List? There's a field "DurFrames" for clip length in frames.
 
I wonder how hard it's going to be to make Avid XML to FCP XML transform. That will be interesting.

As for the OP, I've yet to find an Avid bin I couldn't open (regardless of version it was created on, even 10 year old Film Composer). Avid really has made it a priority to keep interversion compatibility.
 
MetaCheater will have a limited life once we start getting the additional metadata form the XML and directly from the R3D files. For example, in Redcine XML, you also get offset for a resize on a per clip basis, handles, etc. that are not part of the MetaCheater capabilities since it only looks at the file name and the timecode inside the QT. The rest is reconstructed from the file name.

There is also work being done at RED that Deanan and I have been making sure tracks a lot of metadata from Redline that will be out in the near future. The goal of the XML is it will pass through all the source/record metadata from the standard columns as well as the custom metadata so that downstream processes can repurpose.


Michael
 
MichaelP said:
MetaCheater will have a limited life once we start getting the additional metadata form the XML and directly from the R3D files. For example, in Redcine XML, you also get offset for a resize on a per clip basis, handles, etc. that are not part of the MetaCheater capabilities since it only looks at the file name and the timecode inside the QT. The rest is reconstructed from the file name.

There is also work being done at RED that Deanan and I have been making sure tracks a lot of metadata from Redline that will be out in the near future. The goal of the XML is it will pass through all the source/record metadata from the standard columns as well as the custom metadata so that downstream processes can repurpose.


Michael
Click to expand...

You didn't answer the question :bleh:
I was just curious for those of us with projects that started with a Metacheater generated ALE and where the finish will be with the new XML Export.
 
You will get timecode and filename for the cut. As I said in a previous post, if you did not consolidate or decompose, a transform could be created to reflect the original START/END of the R3D files. The XML is a pull list in the same format as exported with as many fields as can be populated from what is there from the original import.

I need to do some tests to see how much is common or not.

Michael
 
MichaelP said:
You will get timecode and filename for the cut. As I said in a previous post, if you did not consolidate or decompose, a transform could be created to reflect the original START/END of the R3D files. The XML is a pull list in the same format as exported with as many fields as can be populated from what is there from the original import.

I need to do some tests to see how much is common or not.

Michael
Click to expand...

Which post and why can't you consolidate :-)
 
You can consolidate - the issue is that unlike a third party database which always represents the full START and END of sources regardless of what is fed to it (EDL, etc...) the Avid bin is the database. The original import master clips would be the original START and END of the R3D file so creating a pull list from those clips is very straightforward. But when consolidating a clip - the entire known range of that master clips is whatever was used to create it plus handles as defined by the user which in most cases is always a subset of the original clip. If a downstream application expects to see a pull list that matches the original START and END, it is no longer possible to do that from a consolidated clip and puts the onus on the user to always keep the original master clips and do a "relink to" to get there. While not impossible, it can become quite unwieldy depending on number of dailies.

What we are planning to do is add original START and END as a separate metadata column so regardless of what happens to the master clip through the post process, will always have access to that particular metadata so any type of list can be generated from a sequence - basically bringing along the original database with it as a self contained module and accessed through the export XML - so a single file contains the edit span, the defined handles, and the original span all in one place to be parsed as needed for any one process.

Michael
 
MichaelP said:
The RedCine XML pull list is dependent on the values of the original clip length of the R3D file - in the RedCine XML to ALE file we preserve this as additional metadata to make sure it does not get truncated via consolidation or decompose processes.
Michael
Click to expand...

Is it possible to release this XML->ALE tool (applet/droplet?) before the release of the Filmscribe XML export.

That way we can start editing and benefit from the workflow in MC/FilmScribe v3.
 
I am close to getting that out -maybe Monday or Tuesday (June 2, 2008). It is an XSLT file that will take the RedCine XML to ALE. I need to check one thing to make sure it works. Also, the version will not support subclips created in RedCine too well downstream until I get an XML change in RedCine Export.


Michael
 
MichaelP said:
I am close to getting that out -maybe Monday or Tuesday (June 2, 2008). It is an XSLT file that will take the RedCine XML to ALE. I need to check one thing to make sure it works. Also, the version will not support subclips created in RedCine too well downstream until I get an XML change in RedCine Export.


Michael
Click to expand...

where can we get it?
 
Attached are some updated RedCine XML to ALE. Directions are the same as in the previous link. Keep all the files from the zip in the same directory when using.

Michael
 
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