Shoulder Dovetail doesn't fit

[Jeff Barklage]

I just received my RED Shoulder Dovetail and is does not fit into the baseplate's dovetail cut-out.
I checked it both from the front & from the back...no dice.
I checked it against my standard Arriflex baseplates [Arri BP-3, BP-4 & BP-7] and it will not fit any of these either.
Looking at it up against the RED baseplate, the Shoulder Dovetail seems to have been machined at a slighty different angle, a bit too verticle and thus it will not slide into the RED baseplate.
I tried a little CRC-556 silicone [which I've used for years on my Arri cameras] and this didn;t help either.
Has anyone else had the same problem when trying to slide the RED shoulder dovetail into the RED baseplate?

 

[Greg M]

the red base is not Arri standard so it won't fit on an Arri base


Regarding the angle, sounds like you are trying to put it on upside down

 

[Ketch Rossi]

I also just received maine, and I was going to sale it with the box sealed, but just opened and try it out to insure the proper fitting after reading your post.


The new RED SHOULDER DOVETAIL fits Perfectly in to the RED BOTTOM PLATE!

BTW, I'm amazed every time I get something from RED, how incredibly well the goods are packaged and protected in the generous amount of bubble rapping.

Any way Jeff, now because of you I'll be selling it as an open box

ciao

 

[Shawn Booth]

Are you talking about the RED bottom plate or the "RED" ARRI base plate?
My shoulder dovetail slides right into the bottom plate no problem.

 

[Damon Meledones]

Have a look at this thread concerning dovetail tune-ups. You might be experiencing some baseplate warping similar to the OP of that thread.

 

[Jeff Barklage]

So let me get this straight:
the ET 15mm RED baseplate [which is Arri standard] has a different dovetail angle milled in it as opposed to the RED BOTTOM PLATE?
Why in the world would anyone ever design base & bottomplates with different dovetail dimensions?
So, if I understand this right, when I pull the camera off of a head and wish to hand-hold, I must remove the ET baseplate, and mount a Bottom plate?
A lot extra work.
Am I reading this correct?

 

[Jeff Coatney]

I believe the prevailing thinking on having non-interchangeable parts (i.e. Arri vs Red dovetails) is to protect the (lucrative) accessory market. Since Arri accessories are incredibly over-priced for the level of current manufacturing technology required to make them, it is easy to undercut them in the market by making cheaper versions. Whether the Arri gear is protected by patent, or Red just wants to avoid the obvious and seemingly obligatory quality comparison uproar (which is counter-productive for everybody) your guess is as good as mine. In my case, we will have to abandon the entire line of RED accessories completely from the lens down all because RED doesn't make a dovetail plate. I am disappointed to do this since we paid for it all. But, for the sake of one piece of machined aluminum that would take me 45 minutes to build in SolidWorks and a couple of hours to cut on the CNC (Which I don't have access to anymore) I will be giving hundreds of dollars to someone else. As I understand it, yes, you Sir, are reading this correctly... as am I.

 

[tony gardiner]

We had this exact problem of the shoulder red shoulder dovetail not fitting on to the red ET arri plate (19mm) to solve this we had the shoulder dovetail machined down to fit the et plate. So now the shoulder plate just slides in nicely, of course the standard red bottom plate is now useless.

 

[Filipo]

BTW, I'm amazed every time I get something from RED, how incredibly well the goods are packaged and protected in the generous amount of bubble rapping.

I dont like how LCD is protected !

Everything else is just perfect !

 

[Jeff Barklage]

Jeff, since you machined the Shoulder Dovetail to fit the ET Baseplate [I was hoping this could work], did you have any problem with the material which the Shoulder Dovetail was cast in?
I think this is a good answer...especially since the overall design seems very nice as well as the soft rubber pad itself.
But, once it is machined, does the original lock on the Shoulder Dovetail still work in conjunction with the ET Baseplate?

 

[Greg M]

Yes, unfortunately they are two different designs...If you want Arri compatibility you go with the Red/ET Arri Base (15mm or 19mm)...this has been discussed at length here on the forum.

The Red base is a low cost stand alone option.

BTW- I use the 19mm Arri base on my camera and simply slide it off my OConnor head and go straight to handheld. Unfortunately There is no pad option currently, but I think one is coming soon. I just use a small pad.

btw- did you get the shoulder dovetail to fit?

 

[Jeff Barklage]

Greg,
I bought the RED Production Kit AND the ET 15mm Arri baseplate [all of my accessories for my 35mm cameras are 15mm rod based: matteboxes, follow focus units, lens supports, etc..].
I simply assumed that a dovetail is a dovetail is a dovetail...the ET 15mm baseplate works fine on my O'Connor 2575 & ArriHead-1.
But there must be some tiny difference between the ET baseplate's dovetail [Arri standard] & the RED Bottom-Plate [and hence the Shoulder Dovetail].
I have a ton of 19mm accessories I bought from RED: hand grips: both L & R, Bottom Plate, etc.. that I will never use. I bought these 'sight-unseen' with the rest of my camera. I will put these up for sale or in the junk drawer.
I think I'll take one of my extra Arri BP-3's and the RED Shoulder Dovetail to a machinist friend and have him re-machine it to work with the Arri standard dovetails.
It simply seems illogical to have a proprietary dovetail AND a standard dovetail all available..there should be some visual disclaimer that states which dovetail works with with accessory. This camera system is so incredible that something like this seems out of place.

 

[Jeff Barklage]

I just did a double check of the RED STORE website.
Sure enough, it lists the Shoulder Dovetail as mating with the RED Bottom Plate. No where does it mention the 15 or 19mm Base Plate.
My bad...I should have looked a lot closer.

 

[Jeff Coatney]

I just did a double check of the RED STORE website.
Sure enough, it lists the Shoulder Dovetail as mating with the RED Bottom Plate. No where does it mention the 15 or 19mm Base Plate.
My bad...I should have looked a lot closer.

In my opinion, no one should have to look closer. This dovetail thing should work like a Lego set regardless of where you get it. Since it doesn't, it should be clearly spelled out for doofi like myself.