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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Build 16 Warning!

Jannard

Jannard

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Build 16 is a monumental change to everything RED as far as the image quality, DSP and methodology is concerned. You may be surprised at how different it is from previous builds in how it looks and works. You will have to alter your thinking just a bit. What you see on the monitor and how you make exposure decisions will change. All for the better, but it will be a change.

We all wish we had done this from the beginning, but you have to walk before you run.

We just don't want anyone to be shocked when you fire it up.

Alpha build is just around the corner. Depending on the feedback we get from those chosen few, the Beta build should not be long after.

Exciting times.

Now, back to solving production problems... ugh.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
We all wish we had done this from the beginning, but you have to walk before you run.
Click to expand...

It feels to me like you just bypassed that whole walking phase?

Some times you have to run before you can walk... and then you have to solve the icing problem while plummeting from 70,000 feet.

And I'm loving every minute of it- can't wait for 16.
 
Jannard said:
You may be surprised at how different it is from previous builds in how it looks and works. You will have to alter your thinking just a bit. What you see on the monitor and how you make exposure decisions will change.
Click to expand...

Like, we're going to have to read tea leaves?

I'm kinda racking my brain as to how different it could possibly be. Perhaps ISO could go away entirely and it would be all about the histograms and false color.

Can't be that different.
 
Jim,

Some questions for you.

1. Build 16 sounds exciting, but will there be any conflicts with existing footage? You've mentioned that REDCINE, RED Alert have all had to go through re-writes, and I'm wondering if we will see any issues with say mixing proxy files from footage shot on build 15 with proxies from build 16?

2. Now that we have had time to play with RED footage as it stands now, will you be releasing a comprehensive guide along with the build 16 rollout that goes into detail what has changed, best practices for using the new build, etc. I only ask because when I see monumental change mentioned, that makes me want to know exactly what has changed so I can re-program my brain.

3. This may be a Graeme question, but what exactly have you discovered that made you go back to the drawing board and rework a lot of this? I'm all for improvements to image quality but curiosity is getting the best of me.

Thanks Jim, and look forward to seeing what you and the team have come up with.
 
Jannard said:
...What you see on the monitor and how you make exposure decisions will change. All for the better, but it will be a change...
We just don't want anyone to be shocked when you fire it up...

Jim
Click to expand...

This almost sounds like we will need to re-learn how to film using Red!!! I good training video (shot on Red, of course) will not be a bad idea if it is so radical...:waaa:
 
I just wonder if it's such a good idea to keep making improvements. The price range, the functionality of the firmware, the improving software... RED is making a lot of people who have spent LOTS of their lives learning various shooting techniques more or less redundant--because you are taking much of the mystery out of doing that work with the evolving RED system.

Is this right? Is this good for the economy? What will happen to California?

On the other hand, if California falls off into the ocean, save for the blockbusters the movie-making industry shouldn't skip a beat.
 
Wow, so one of these days, I'll actually be able to afford a camera, and this will begin to matter to me. Man, getting started in this industry sucks.

But I guess it's better than getting started in any other.:shifty:
 
My guess is making a change during a shoot is pretty much always a bad idea. I wouldn't switch from my HVX to a PMW-EX1 in the middle of a shoot, and it sounds like there may be a difference (at least in gamma, etc...) of a similar magnitude? Maybe?

Maybe I'm talking out my #ss here.:huh:
 
number6 said:
I just wonder if it's such a good idea to keep making improvements. The price range, the functionality of the firmware, the improving software... RED is making a lot of people who have spent LOTS of their lives learning various shooting techniques more or less redundant--because you are taking much of the mystery out of doing that work with the evolving RED system.
Click to expand...

Not even close. It is a very flawed opinion that believes owning a red will instantly give you skills that take years to learn. A camera is not a shortcut to success, experience and hard work is what gets you there.
 
Finner said:
Not even close. It is a very flawed opinion that believes owning a red will instantly give you skills that take years to learn. A camera is not a shortcut to success, experience and hard work is what gets you there.
Click to expand...

Finner, didn't we have this discussion about a year ago? I thought I convinced you I was right... guess you backslid.:tongue:
 
David Mullen ASC said:
I start shooting a small RED feature the day after Memorial Day -- will Build 16 be available by then? Anything wrong with Build 15? Should one ever change builds once you start shooting?
Click to expand...

David... nothing wrong with Build 15.

Build 16 may not be completely stable by the time you begin shooting, but we'll see. Once it is, there is no downside to switching. Except about a ten minute discussion on what is different and how to expose given the differences. Actually, It took me about ten minutes... you'll probably get it in two. :-)

Jim
 
David Mullen ASC said:
I start shooting a small RED feature the day after Memorial Day -- will Build 16 be available by then? Anything wrong with Build 15? Should one ever change builds once you start shooting?
Click to expand...

I know they hate (or more technically, can't accurately guess) dates, but I'm in the same boat as you. We start filming on a Hollywood picture (a sequel to a well known movie) on May 19, and a lot of it is shot night for night, so it sounds like we really could use this build. This is compounded by the DP being very nervous about switching builds part way through filming. So I'd hate to be stuck on build 15 through the whole shoot.

I REALLY hope we can use build 16 by the 19th... no pressure though. :)
 
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