Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Adobe - A new hope

Roger Singh said:
..
Apple
Assimilate
Adobe
Avid
you forgot to add Autodesk to add to the A List ;)
Click to expand...

Its important to understand that there is one difference:

While
Avid (~$910M revenue),
Adobe Systems ($3.157 billion revenue),
Apple (24.01 billion revenue) and
Autodesk ($1.840 billion revenue)
are -big- "A"s, and offer many different products for many different markets, Assimiliate is a very small company, especially in comparison, and "only" in one market. I actually dont know how large the corporation is, but i would guestimate in the two digit million area in revenue and <50 employees.

That can be an advantage for our market, or a disadvantage - depending on their management goals. Red is a brilliant example how much a "small" company can achieve, on the other hand are many defunct (or bought and integrated) smaller corps.
 
Mark Allen said:
I own the adobe suite and if it supported redcode.... I might actually use premiere. Something I don't do at all at the moment.
Click to expand...

Premiere has grown pretty powerful meanwhile, especially teamed with 3hrd party hardware (aja, decklink, axio etc) and/or software (as cineform).

We have several $$$.$$$ NLEs from the big names here, but Premiere (and FCP) are used more and more recently.
 
If the Adobe Suite supported RAW natively the way I thought FCP would do after last NAB, I'd probably jump ship... With or without cineform.


Gunleik
 
laguun said:
Its important to understand that there is one difference:

While
Avid (~$910M revenue),
Adobe Systems ($3.157 billion revenue),
Apple (24.01 billion revenue) and
Autodesk ($1.840 billion revenue)
are -big- "A"s, and offer many different products for many different markets, Assimiliate is a very small company, especially in comparison, and "only" in one market. I actually dont know how large the corporation is, but i would guestimate in the two digit million area in revenue and <50 employees.

That can be an advantage for our market, or a disadvantage - depending on their management goals. Red is a brilliant example how much a "small" company can achieve, on the other hand are many defunct (or bought and integrated) smaller corps.
Click to expand...

You should correct Apples numbers since they have few different businesses.
How much revenue Apple has from FCP?
They are very small player once you subtract the cell phone iPod and hardware business.
I think Adobe is clear winner.
 
Andrew said:
You should correct Apples numbers since they have few different businesses.
How much revenue Apple has from FCP?
They are very small player once you subtract the cell phone iPod and hardware business.
I think Adobe is clear winner.
Click to expand...

By the same logic, I'd suggest a significant part of Adobe's business is unrelated to video (Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator, Macromedia products, etc). Autodesk has a huge business in non-video too (Autocad, 3DS Max, etc). Even Avid, while being mainly a video company, has large parts of it's business that aren't editing.

Comparing numbers isn't going to help.

I think FCP possibly has the largest installed base. While Avid probably has the largest portion of the 'professional film and tv' market. Adobe, while not having Premiere as a leading NLE in most places does have a lot of penetration. Almost every post house I know of has multiple copies of Premiere (as they buy the Adobe Production bundle).
 
Andrew said:
You should correct Apples numbers since they have few different businesses.
How much revenue Apple has from FCP?
They are very small player once you subtract the cell phone iPod and hardware business.
I think Adobe is clear winner.
Click to expand...

if you look at software only, adobe is the leader.
followed by autodesk, but if you look at media, avid is slightly before adsk.

however i just wanted to point out that there are big As and smaller one, without judgement, as both has advantages and disadvantages.

btw, avid lowered the price of media composer to 2495$ and 295$ for students/colleges/teachers/non-profit today.
 
TAFKAR said:
if you look at software only, adobe is the leader.
followed by autodesk, but if you look at media, avid is slightly before adsk.

however i just wanted to point out that there are big As and smaller one, without judgement, as both has advantages and disadvantages.

btw, avid lowered the price of media composer to 2495$ and 295$ for students/colleges/teachers/non-profit today.
Click to expand...


AAAAArrrrrgh!

Thats what happening if you have visits from other fellow redusers - suddenly your desktop systems are logged in on their accounts on - reduser :)

above post was by laguun btw and yes tafkar was in the studio....
 
Sycophant said:
By the same logic, I'd suggest a significant part of Adobe's business is unrelated to video (Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator, Macromedia products, etc).
Click to expand...

Acrobat is actually the top selling application! The creative solutions business unit (CS3 etc) is about 60% of the total revenue.
 
Hi All,

Everybody seems to think that once the .r3d file format is "opened up" that they will be able to use the native RED footage just as they would use other media formats such as DPX, AVI & QT.

I don't believe this will EVER happen. R3D is not a CODEC. It can't be.

R3D is a type of data structure derived from photons hitting a CMOS sensor in the camera -and then being processed via a number of hardware circuitry stages before being saved to the CF card or hard drive(s).

You can DEcode R3D on a computer, but you can't ENcode it... There is no "CODEC" for R3D, and as such, your options for working with the native footage will be limited to playback, cuts-only editing and grading.

As cool as it might be to think about, my belief is that "normal" editing tasks such as cross-dissolves in your Premier (or FCP) timeline and/or multilayer compositing (AE, Nuke, Flame, etc) using native r3d files are never going to happen.

At least, not that I can foresee.

At least for now, I think people would be well-advised to steady themselves with the realization that projects being shot on RED (or any of the other 2K/4K digital cameras that generate "RAW" fotage) will need to "build in" the time & expense of transcoding the footage before they can engage on the post production process.

No other 2K/4K acquisition platforms allow you to simply yank the footage off the camera and inject it directly into the post production pipeline. That's a pipedream.

How could anybody expect .r3d to be any different?
 
BOXXLabs said:
No other 2K/4K acquisition platforms allow you to simply yank the footage off the camera and inject it directly into the post production pipeline. That's a pipedream.
Click to expand...

Doesn't SI2k record straight to Cineform? That can be immediately opened, edited and saved back to Cineform... and it's a compressed Raw format.

From Si2k's site:
"The CineForm RAW™ Digital Intermediate codec enables editing and effects to be done in real-time at the user's demand without the hefty cost penalty of high-bandwidth RAID arrays and post gear traditionally associated with 10-bit uncompressed HD workflows. Combine Digital Intermediate AVI and Quicktime files with other YUV or HDV sources on the same timeline and perform real-time editing of up to 4 1080/24p HD streams, without dropped frames or the need to render."

RED is also Wavelet based - like Cineform and ProRes (Prores may be something else)... perhaps RED is developing a CODEC so it performs similarly to the SI2k camera.

But I don't know jack about codecs... perhaps Graeme or Jarred could straighten this out.
 
gunleik said:
Is ProRes wavelet... ?

G
Click to expand...

Wavelet-based compression may not be the best compression for all scenes. Actually, the best compression using some standardized notion of signal processing is the one using principal component analysis (PCA). Nothing can beat that. However, there is a problem with that. Each image would require different basis functions dependent upon image content.

Therefore, compression schemes using fixed notion of basis functions such as DCT-based MPEG-2, MPEG-4, and non-DCTs such as wavelets, etc., thrive on the fact that for *natural* images their basis functions are pretty close to those derived from PCAs of such images, and hence, sub-optimal, being approximately close enough to the PCAs.
 
Joofa said:
Wavelet-based compression may not be the best compression for all scenes. Actually, the best compression using some standardized notion of signal processing is the one using principal component analysis (PCA). Nothing can beat that. However, there is a problem with that. Each image would require different basis functions dependent upon image content.

Therefore, compression schemes using fixed notion of basis functions such as DCT-based MPEG-2, MPEG-4, and non-DCTs such as wavelets, etc., thrive on the fact that for *natural* images their basis functions are pretty close to those derived from PCAs of such images, and hence, sub-optimal, being approximately close enough to the PCAs.
Click to expand...

When Joofa speaks, I STFU. :innocent:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top