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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

temperature problem under +3° C

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firstcamera

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Hello folks,

today i have tried to test the RED #48 in munich outside.
In munich/germany it was between -3 and +3 degrees celsius today.

After the Red was out in the cold for about 1/2 hour, the cam was not working any more (switched to on after 1/2 an hour in the cold).
There was just a strange image of bluish bars.
So actually the cam worked in terms of power supply and booting (the menu and the red logo were displayed normally), but there was no image on the CF-Card and on the monitor just the strange pattern of blue bars.

Once the cam was back in room-temperature-conditions for 15min., all was working normally again after a reboot.
We went out in the cold again with the still booted cam and after 15min. we experienced problems again.
Different problems, we got format errors.

Any more input from you guys about temperature conditions and the red cam?

Is there a possibillity to display the inner temperature of the cam?



Thanx a lot.

Cheers,

Emanuel Schwermer, BVK
DP
Munich-Germany
www.firstcamera.de
 
Did you already try covering the camera with something?
 
Haven't you heard, you need the BLUE camera to shoot in sub zero ;)
Seriously, I hope this can't be as serious as it sounds. We have below zero six months a year here. What was the humidity inside/outside?
 
No, we did not cover the cam with something.
But I believe, it won´t help (the number 48) to just cover it, i think it has to be at least a heated barney.

But I believe also, there are more people out here in that forum they have tested the cam also in cold conditions.

Please post guys!

Cheers,

Emanuel
 
OK,
nice joke Fredrik!
But, did you shoot outside with the red in the six month of cold, where ever you based?

The humidity was absolutely moderate today!
I dont know the degrees exactly, but for me it was really dry day!

This should be a serious discussion!

Cheers
 
The cooling fan

The cooling fan

Was the cooling fan on? Try it with the fan turned off. The fan would pull the cold air into the camera making it like an icebox inside. Give it a go, it might help. :cold:
 
Yes,
the fan was working all the time the camera was not recording (normal)!
Could this be the solution?
Thanx for your great input!
This could really solve the prob i believe!
I will test this tomorrow.

Cheers,

Emanuel
 
Are you 100% sure the problems are actually temperature based? I've had issues that I was sure were temp/humidity based that turned out not to be. The slight temp difference in fan on/off isn't likely to 'solve' your problems.
 
Temperature voodoo???

Temperature voodoo???

Have had a little temperature voodoo with #19 as well. Currently shooting in San Francisco with temps in the 50's (12-14 celcius) with high humidity and the cam has been OK but the LCD went on the fritz last night.

I don't know if the issues are serious but this is something that needs to be investigated by RED. I have wondered if expansion and contraction caused by the temp changes are impacting the electrical system? Powering and booting issues seem anecdotally linked to climactic conditions. Perhaps there is an ideal thermal operation zone that needs to be managed by the fan system?

I am not an engineer but someone who is should run a proper battery of tests if they haven't already. Perhaps late stage design mods have impacted sub-systems that were not expected to be issues?
 
Interesting.. I think we need some more testing.

-3C (about 27F) isn't that cold, I would be surprised if the cold was truly the issue here and as long as the gear is acclimated to the surroundings and there's no blowing moisture or high wind chill, it shouldn't even need a cover. I haven't run across any other cameras that need covers for warmth in that temperature range.

Did your batteries happen to get frozen? Could it have been a power issue? If the camera's fan was running, that's a sign it thought there was a need to cool itself still.

I'm very interested to see what is learned here. I need to shoot in temps as low as -25F (-32C).
 
Perhaps a media issue? Is there a backup Compact Flash media of a different make or brand that can be used? The industrial grade CF's are rated for use at -40° to +85° C.

Maybe this issue will also help identify which RED storage media (CF, SATA, or Red Drive) has more 'robustness and stability' under extreme or hostile recording conditions.
 
TeamWB said:
Was the cooling fan on? Try it with the fan turned off. The fan would pull the cold air into the camera making it like an icebox inside. Give it a go, it might help. :cold:
Click to expand...

I have no empirical data to support my experiences, like the original post for this thread, just common sense. One camera from the first 100 RED's does not denote a problem with the RED shooting in cold weather. Let's be proactive and not reactive. That's what I love about this community. A collection of bright cutting edge camera geeks. Well certainly the latter myself included :-)

Always a good idea to send a detailed message of the shooting scenario and camera responses to the RED Team, if you haven't already, and keep them in the loop as they may have some ideas/solutions. Jim seems like the kind of guy that would personally take several cameras into a walk in freezer and test this himself - or maybe he'd send Jarred :-)

Also, the suggestion from this board is what I tried. I experienced a one time codec record error in flight with the RED camera flying at over 100 knots fully exposed to the atmosphere at an OAT of below 40F. I then did the wind chill math and realized that I was below freezing - duh!

I landed - turned the fan to off and the camera recorded the rest of the aerials no problem. Like I said, no science here just common sense and it worked.

Sharky
 
firstcamera said:
OK,
nice joke Fredrik!
But, did you shoot outside with the red in the six month of cold, where ever you based?

The humidity was absolutely moderate today!
I dont know the degrees exactly, but for me it was really dry day!

This should be a serious discussion!

Cheers
Click to expand...

I absolutely understand the seriousness in this issue, sorry for joking. I haven't got my camera yet, but being able to shoot in the winter is of course something that is absolutely necessary. I live in Norway.

I really hope this gets cleared up, both for you and for the future.
 
Turning the fan off... or putting it into "Silent" mode should do the trick as Sharky suggests. We are doing some testing now to see if we can offer some other suggestions. We also included the "Cold weather" filters with 51-100. They should have been put in the box and not installed so they needed to be removed for normal shooting. But they can be put back in for cold weather shooting. They limit the amount of (cold) air entering the camera.

Jim
 
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