I thought i wanted a RED Scarlet do I ?

[jimhare]

Hi Zharmane,

Another consideration is how much money you think you could make in the interim, while waiting for the BMC. For example, if you think you could make and extra $1,000 a month by having a great camera right now, you will more than make up the difference in price.

If you aren't making money with a camera, and it's just for personal projects, then always best to spend less and work around any compromises such as lens mounts, jello etc. Pretty easy to do as we've seen from the great results achievable on a D-SLR when willing to work for it.

What I think you would agree with is that the Scarlet and BMC are not the same camera at different price points. If you don't believe this then get the BMC, easy decision.

If you do believe, then weigh up the difference in value it has to you and go from there.

Personally, I don't believe the BMC is as good as a Scarlet but that's not the point. All that matters is whether it will suit your needs. If it does then it will serve you well for the right price!

I'm pretty tempted by the new $995 pocket cam! Great replacement for a D-SLR as a C-cam in my shoots.

 

[Zharmane Washington]

Hi Zharmane,

Another consideration is how much money you think you could make in the interim, while waiting for the BMC. For example, if you think you could make and extra $1,000 a month by having a great camera right now, you will more than make up the difference in price.

If you aren't making money with a camera, and it's just for personal projects, then always best to spend less and work around any compromises such as lens mounts, jello etc. Pretty easy to do as we've seen from the great results achievable on a D-SLR when willing to work for it.

What I think you would agree with is that the Scarlet and BMC are not the same camera at different price points. If you don't believe this then get the BMC, easy decision.

If you do believe, then weigh up the difference in value it has to you and go from there.

Personally, I don't believe the BMC is as good as a Scarlet but that's not the point. All that matters is whether it will suit your needs. If it does then it will serve you well for the right price!

I'm pretty tempted by the new $995 pocket cam! Great replacement for a D-SLR as a C-cam in my shoots.

I agree i still want a scarlet ... i like that 16mm cam as well i am going sell my Canon for just by a scarlet and get the 16mm as well... It will be a slow build for the scarlet. but i do want the 16mm I think that is very impressive. I think its safe to say BM stole RED concept and ran with it but hey... The camera world moves fast and thats is good and bad but Sucks as well ... I would have hate to be a person that just received BMCC 2k and their talk about a 4k camera for 4k ... too soon but what can we do? i love the RED concept build as you need. Thanks i think i know what i am going to do.

 

[Zharmane Washington]

Bird

 

[Jason Honeycutt]

I think at the end of the day... do you want to make really nice-looking short films and not do commercial work... or do you want RED? Clients want RED or Alexa... but if you don't want to "make money" on it and just use it for fun, then BMCC is a great option to make fun videos on your own.

 

[Michael Patterson]

I think it's weird that now that 4k is in the specs for cameras, all of a sudden these cameras are considered competitors. A few years ago when 1080p was the thing, no one was comparing a panasonic hpx with an Alexa or Varicam or something else. They all shoot 1080p but they are at different price points for different reasons. I'm not saying one is not able to create great content with something that isn't the "best" camera. I don't know about the bmc yet. It may be awesome or it may just be a big headache. I don't really care. I like my camera and I think it makes me a better shooter. If someone beats me out for a job using a $4k 4k camera, then it's my fault. Not my Scarlets. I think we are going to be hitting a bit of a wall here soon with all sorts of cameras making great looking images. That's ok. I'd rather be given a job based on my work. I don't want to be the ugly guy with the hot girl that everyone knows is with me cause I have a Ferrari. I want to be the guy who has a Ferrari cause he loves what he can do with it and the pride it gives. Shoot with what makes you happy and what makes you excited to go to work. Until I received my Scarlet, I haven't been this excited to go out and shoot since I was 20 running around with a shitty bolex and some expired film. Buy a bmc if you want one or buy a Scarlet. Buy both if you want. I'm happy I went red and I'm really happy I had the opportunity to upgrade to Scarlet Dragon. For me it's the perfect camera. Others went Epic. Others will go epic dragon and others won't do anything. Everyone has their reason for picking what they want to work with. In the end, just pick something and get out and do something with it. Good luck.

 

[jimhare]

jimhare ---- > Sydney Australia i know its hot there ... I am in Michigan and its still cold ... lol

Heh! Yep, pretty much paradise! :thumbsup:

 

[Zharmane Washington]

I think it's weird that now that 4k is in the specs for cameras, all of a sudden these cameras are considered competitors. A few years ago when 1080p was the thing, no one was comparing a panasonic hpx with an Alexa or Varicam or something else. They all shoot 1080p but they are at different price points for different reasons. I'm not saying one is not able to create great content with something that isn't the "best" camera. I don't know about the bmc yet. It may be awesome or it may just be a big headache. I don't really care. I like my camera and I think it makes me a better shooter. If someone beats me out for a job using a $4k 4k camera, then it's my fault. Not my Scarlets. I think we are going to be hitting a bit of a wall here soon with all sorts of cameras making great looking images. That's ok. I'd rather be given a job based on my work. I don't want to be the ugly guy with the hot girl that everyone knows is with me cause I have a Ferrari. I want to be the guy who has a Ferrari cause he loves what he can do with it and the pride it gives. Shoot with what makes you happy and what makes you excited to go to work. Until I received my Scarlet, I haven't been this excited to go out and shoot since I was 20 running around with a shitty bolex and some expired film. Buy a bmc if you want one or buy a Scarlet. Buy both if you want. I'm happy I went red and I'm really happy I had the opportunity to upgrade to Scarlet Dragon. For me it's the perfect camera. Others went Epic. Others will go epic dragon and others won't do anything. Everyone has their reason for picking what they want to work with. In the end, just pick something and get out and do something with it. Good luck.

You Up grading to Red Dragon why not just buy the red dragon and keep the scarlet?


What is the price tag on the RED SCARLET DRAGON....Not the up grade 6k is overkill.. Bang Bang your Dead o yea bang Bang your still dead man that is crazy.

 

[Michael Patterson]

You Up grading to Red Dragon why not just buy the red dragon and keep the scarlet?


What is the price tag on the RED SCARLET DRAGON....Not the up grade 6k is overkill.. Bang Bang your Dead o yea bang Bang your still dead man that is crazy.

I guess I'm a bit confused about your question. The Scarlet trade-in/upgrade program equates to upgrading a car lets say. If you want to go Scarlet Dragon you are basically putting in a new engine in the car you already own. You'll get better performance but you still have the same body. If I wanted to keep my Scarlet as is I'd basically be hanging on to it and buying something completely new. So I'd have 2 cars when I only need one plus not to mention it'd be a heck of a lot of money to have 2 cams. I can only drive one car at a time. Plus the price of a new Scarlet Dragon hasn't been released yet and I suppose RED could decide they won't even build that camera. I don't remember reading that this is for sure or not. I'm guessing it'll happen but it seems like this option won't surface until the upgrades are well under way.

 

[Zharmane Washington]

I guess I'm a bit confused about your question. The Scarlet trade-in/upgrade program equates to upgrading a car lets say. If you want to go Scarlet Dragon you are basically putting in a new engine in the car you already own. You'll get better performance but you still have the same body. If I wanted to keep my Scarlet as is I'd basically be hanging on to it and buying something completely new. So I'd have 2 cars when I only need one plus not to mention it'd be a heck of a lot of money to have 2 cams. I can only drive one car at a time. Plus the price of a new Scarlet Dragon hasn't been released yet and I suppose RED could decide they won't even build that camera. I don't remember reading that this is for sure or not. I'm guessing it'll happen but it seems like this option won't surface until the upgrades are well under way.

yeah i went back and look.... I just dont see the purpose of the up grade if you can spend 9500 on upgrade your may as well get an epic and call it good... but i guess the 22 stops will be worth it. i guess... i have three cars and drive them all so the car thing not a good example for me... so you dont get the 6k ?

#1. Trade in your Scarlet to Full Epic-X (including new black body) - $9500. After that.. you can upgrade your Epic-X to Full Epic Dragon through the normal Epic-X to Dragon process.

#2. Upgrade your Scarlet to Scarlet Dragon - $9500 ( keep your grey body ) Get all the dynamic range and new color science of the Dragon with a max framerate of 5K 60fps. Full specs to come soon.

Pre-orders begin this Thursday. Upgrades begin July.

 

[Sergio Perez]

My suggestion? Get an Epic X. The thing is you'll lust the additional frame rates no matter what. The Epic X is going for an incredible price right now for the camera it is. And most of the "beta" epic problems are long gone and ypu have one solid, proven, multi million dollar picture capable camera- one responsible one of the most recent box office successes in history (the Hobbit). Forget about the Dragon now. Also look for the sea of redrockets that are going to appear on the used market from the ones upgrading to the X because of the Dragon. Great time to get an EPIC right now.

 

[Adam Beck]

As a few have said on here already, you should compare your type of projects or business strategy to the different types of cameras before you start comparing camera versus camera. It may change your perspective.

Good luck with your discussion.

 

[Justin Loera]

Are we expecting to see some price drops in the near future? Weird timing and all.. but right now with all this talk about the BMCC, Canon and Red might seriously take some dents in their sales.. Anyone considering a Canon Mark 3 at this point can spend a little more and get a BMPC4k & apparently get a ridiculously better picture.. On top of that, anyone upgrading from a DSLR that wants a Red, now might quickly be turned away toward the BMPC, based entirely on price.. Any opinions?

 

[Zharmane Washington]

Are we expecting to see some price drops in the near future? Weird timing and all.. but right now with all this talk about the BMCC, Canon and Red might seriously take some dents in their sales.. Anyone considering a Canon Mark 3 at this point can spend a little more and get a BMCC4k & apparently get a ridiculously better picture.. On top of that, anyone upgrading from a DSLR that wants a Red, now might quickly be turned away toward the BMCC, based entirely on price.. Any opinions?

I like the canon the mark 3 but not for me I sold my m3 like a month ago... i was trying to get a used scarlet and i spent some the funds ... i will get a scarlet jus going to be a slow build

 

[Zharmane Washington]

My suggestion? Get an Epic X. The thing is you'll lust the additional frame rates no matter what. The Epic X is going for an incredible price right now for the camera it is. And most of the "beta" epic problems are long gone and ypu have one solid, proven, multi million dollar picture capable camera- one responsible one of the most recent box office successes in history (the Hobbit). Forget about the Dragon now. Also look for the sea of redrockets that are going to appear on the used market from the ones upgrading to the X because of the Dragon. Great time to get an EPIC right now.

that is very true...

 

[Justin Loera]

I like the canon the mark 3 but not for me I sold my m3 like a month ago... i was trying to get a used scarlet and i spent some the funds ... i will get a scarlet jus going to be a slow build

I still plan on picking up a scarlet. But what I'm hoping is that if we're a little more patient, we may see some more significant price cuts from RED in order to compete with the new BMCC shipping out in June.. I guess we will find out

 

[Arnold F.]

RED is a proven company with lots of viewable footage and the other is not (yet). That said, based on past history, the Scarlet price (not price point) will absolutely lower but who knows when or how much.

A note about the mostly-incorrectly term price point; it's not the same as price. If you mean "price" you're in luck because you can save some time and leave off "point" (and you won't sound like you're trying to be fancy in the bargain!). One doesn't go to a restaurant or store and ask the price point of something.

 

[Noah Yuan-Vogel]

My suggestion? Get an Epic X. The thing is you'll lust the additional frame rates no matter what. The Epic X is going for an incredible price right now for the camera it is. And most of the "beta" epic problems are long gone and ypu have one solid, proven, multi million dollar picture capable camera- one responsible one of the most recent box office successes in history (the Hobbit). Forget about the Dragon now. Also look for the sea of redrockets that are going to appear on the used market from the ones upgrading to the X because of the Dragon. Great time to get an EPIC right now.

On the other hand, isn't Epic-X bound to quite immediately drop in value as soon as Dragon and especially Scarlet Dragon are rolled out? Who will want to shoot on the camera with 13 stops of dynamic range that doesn't do so well past ISO1000 when a new camera with a next-gen sensor with 16stops and clean ISO2000+ comes out for the same price? I would want to have the new tech that everyone wants to shoot on than a brand new 2 year old camera with a 3 year old sensor. There are a lot of aging cameras out there that are "responsible" for big movies shot in the recent past, but that may not mean much when there is something better since people always want better, even if good enough for 3 years ago seems it should be good enough for now

Also perhaps there is a chance that the new re-engineered OLPF and new sensor's sensitivity and range will offer very different performance for lower resolution modes. With MX, I barely felt 2k high framerates was good enough for the web and a pain to light for due to very high noise levels, and 3k was just good enough for 1080p delivery, but who knows with Dragon, maybe smaller resolutions will be more useable and then maybe high framerates in Scarlet Dragon will be more accessible/practical. 2k Dragon will be more cropped, but if it has the sensitivity and dynamic range of 5k MX, or even just delivers more sharpness than MX's 2K, it may go a long way to actually making crop modes and high framerates more useable and therefore making Scarlet Dragon more competitive against Epic-X. Of course all of this image quality from Dragon remains to be seen, however. And of course it will likely still be a pain to have to shoot so cropped to get high frame rates. Unless they finally allow line skipping/binning modes that allow those low-res high framerates at full or near full sensor sizes... (I'd usually rather the greater chance of aliasing over the definite annoyance of cropped FOV and different DOF)