paulherrin
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How about a transmitter that can reach my camera while it's in orbit?
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RedMote Transmitter
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Nik Harper
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Haha are you sending it out there?
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paulherrin
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Yes, I'd very much like to, unless I can go with it... 
Zach Swena
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What you need is a redmote over IP extender which would also be use full for live broadcast stuff. From there you could send the connection over the wireless control antenna. Are you wanting to just get it in to space, or all the way to orbit? Price to orbit is not cheap, but suborbital flight is fairly simple, and also doesn't require you to commit to it being up there indefinitely. If RED could provide some specs for the redmote wireless link I know some guys that could make an extender. They may be able to do it without specs too, but it would just be harder and I wouldn't want to work behind RED's back.
The cost for an orbital mission would probably be more then epic, and you would not get the camera back unless you sent it to ISS. If you are just after pictures from "space", you could go for a helium based suborbital mission and spend a lot less. I have considered the suborbital option as a senior engineering project on another thread on this forum, but right now that is mothballed as I don't have funding to proceed.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showth...pic-footage-from-the-edge-of-space&highlight=
Another application of a RedMote extender.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?73984-REDmote-Station&highlight=
The cost for an orbital mission would probably be more then epic, and you would not get the camera back unless you sent it to ISS. If you are just after pictures from "space", you could go for a helium based suborbital mission and spend a lot less. I have considered the suborbital option as a senior engineering project on another thread on this forum, but right now that is mothballed as I don't have funding to proceed.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showth...pic-footage-from-the-edge-of-space&highlight=
Another application of a RedMote extender.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?73984-REDmote-Station&highlight=
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paulherrin
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Yeah, I've already been looking into tethered balloon flying for my red and some suborbital timelapse flights for my dslr or a compact camera. If I could ensure the safety of my camera and work out stability problems to get decent video I'd consider sending it up, but I'd really like to be able to have some amount of control over the images. It's still a ways out, but I definitely want to launch a satellite or get my camera on a mission.
Zach Swena
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You would need a 3 axis pan tilt head, live 1080p encoder, and a tracking wireless antenna system with redundancy for communication and monitoring. The recovery system would need to be carefully designed and tested for reliability. It all comes down to spending the money to have it done right, and getting the right engineers on the project. For an orbital mission I would think that you could get much better results from coordinating with a mission to ISS once spacx gets fully up and running then you would with a sattilite. It wouldn't be as long term of a commitment either.
I think you have enough engineering problems to solve with the mission itself that getting your redmote to work to control the camera would be the easy part. You would have to hire an engineer to get a design made up and cost estimated. To do it DIY would be just to risky. To give you a feel though, building an epic sized RC Heli based camera platform is in the $10-20k range delivered off the shelf. I would expect a project like this to cost a bit more.
I may sound like a skeptic, but that's just how I have been trained. This is something I have dreamed of doing too. I really think this would be cool, it just helps to identify the obstacles to be scaled.
Good Luck
I think you have enough engineering problems to solve with the mission itself that getting your redmote to work to control the camera would be the easy part. You would have to hire an engineer to get a design made up and cost estimated. To do it DIY would be just to risky. To give you a feel though, building an epic sized RC Heli based camera platform is in the $10-20k range delivered off the shelf. I would expect a project like this to cost a bit more.
I may sound like a skeptic, but that's just how I have been trained. This is something I have dreamed of doing too. I really think this would be cool, it just helps to identify the obstacles to be scaled.
Good Luck
Alan Skinner
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http://www.spacex.com/Falcon1UsersGuide.pdf
No Problem. Just start saving up some cash. Here is the user manual.
No Problem. Just start saving up some cash. Here is the user manual.
Zach Swena
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From spacex website:
"Current plans are for payloads that would fly on Falcon 1 to be served by flights on the Falcon 9, utilizing excess capacity. This is a very cost-effective solution for small satellite launch needs."
They aren't flying the Falcon 1 right now so they can focus their efforts on ISS resupply and CCDev efforts.
Like I said, you need to have the money to make it happen. Piggybacking on F9 might also allow for not having to buy a whole F1 payload also. For an orbital satellite mission though you would want a few extra million for spacecraft design besides launch cost. I am sure it could be done for $15M total. For some reason though that just makes me want to figure out a way to get it done for less...
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paulherrin
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Well, just because I don't currently have the funding for that doesn't mean I shouldn't look into it and try. You never know, I may be able to piggy back on a mission, or get an artistic grant. I really appreciate the advice. If anyone is interested in putting our heads together to get control of a camera in orbit or suborbit, I'm all about it. Let's talk about the specifics of a durable and foolproof control rig. I'd like to be able to lock on to objects in any direction, whether on earth or in the sky. I'm also wondering what lens might be best suited for this thing...
Shane Betts
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Kickstarter is awaiting your call. Do it, do it, do it!
Zach Swena
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I'm game. I can't work for free on specific system designs, but I'm happy to comment on overall design factors and brain storm. I like to live in the wild ideas file, anything less is boring.
You will want redundancy in at least Uplink, Downlink, and Recovery. Other systems will depend on the weight penalty involved in having a backup. A recovery system is probably not feasible for an orbital mission unless significant funding and access to PICAX material were available. Tracking headings, or points in space is simple. If you want to track an object in the image that's a little more involved, but some of my classmates have a robot playing chess based off camera feedback, so it isn't to overly complicated.
As far as lens goes, you will probably want an electronic lens. Lens servos and control could be put on also, but that is a weight penalty. You will want a lens with a very large aperture. The sensor needs as much light as possible since things are very far away, unless you intend to point it at extremely bright objects. All told, you will be making a trade off between weight and performance. I'll leave any more advice on lenses to those that know what they are talking about more in that regard.
3 Axis pan tilt roll will be required for the camera, there are some off the shelf solutions, but they most likely would need tweaked to get smooth enough response for large zoom levels.
The space craft will need inertial stabilizing control as well, 3 axis for free flying orbit and 2 axis for baloon payload. Power needs to come from somewhere. Batteries work for a short mission with a balloon, but solar panels with attitude control would be needed also for an orbital mission. A free flying spacecraft requires many more systems then one piggybacked on an ISS or Dragon misson.
I am thinking that if this project had a certainty of happening (ie. funding available) we could probably get RED to share enough info under NDA or something to build a WIFI repeater for the redmote. They probably have something better in the works already anyway. I read on the specs page at RED.com for epic and scarlet that there is ethernet remote control, which would be trivial to implement on the spacecraft since the uplink and downlink would be ethernet ip based.
There's a lot more to say, but I don't have more time right now so I will leave it at that.
You will want redundancy in at least Uplink, Downlink, and Recovery. Other systems will depend on the weight penalty involved in having a backup. A recovery system is probably not feasible for an orbital mission unless significant funding and access to PICAX material were available. Tracking headings, or points in space is simple. If you want to track an object in the image that's a little more involved, but some of my classmates have a robot playing chess based off camera feedback, so it isn't to overly complicated.
As far as lens goes, you will probably want an electronic lens. Lens servos and control could be put on also, but that is a weight penalty. You will want a lens with a very large aperture. The sensor needs as much light as possible since things are very far away, unless you intend to point it at extremely bright objects. All told, you will be making a trade off between weight and performance. I'll leave any more advice on lenses to those that know what they are talking about more in that regard.
3 Axis pan tilt roll will be required for the camera, there are some off the shelf solutions, but they most likely would need tweaked to get smooth enough response for large zoom levels.
The space craft will need inertial stabilizing control as well, 3 axis for free flying orbit and 2 axis for baloon payload. Power needs to come from somewhere. Batteries work for a short mission with a balloon, but solar panels with attitude control would be needed also for an orbital mission. A free flying spacecraft requires many more systems then one piggybacked on an ISS or Dragon misson.
I am thinking that if this project had a certainty of happening (ie. funding available) we could probably get RED to share enough info under NDA or something to build a WIFI repeater for the redmote. They probably have something better in the works already anyway. I read on the specs page at RED.com for epic and scarlet that there is ethernet remote control, which would be trivial to implement on the spacecraft since the uplink and downlink would be ethernet ip based.
There's a lot more to say, but I don't have more time right now so I will leave it at that.
Zach Swena
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I don't know if anyone is still interested in doing something like this, but here is a mission profile that could work. I did a bit of looking around to see what type of materials they use for heat shields on spacecraft. At a closer look the heat shield on the Dragon spacecraft is just an advanced form of Phenolic Impregnated Carbon Ablator. Phenolic-Carbon composites are also used in the experimental aircraft world for various structural parts. For an orbital launch you would be looking at around $5-10M launch cost. It wouldn't make much sense to spend much less then $1M on the spacecraft with those types of cost. It may be possible to build something for less, but you want to have sufficient testing and verification so you can be sure that the mission will be a success. Testing and analysis cost money. With that amount of funding it would probably be possible to build a mini capsule to protect Epic. This way, you could actually have a standing chance of recovering the camera.
Something to consider though is that you are spending $5-10M on a rocket that burns up on reentry, this is compared to $60-100k of camera equipment. A suborbital near space mission would be almost trivial in comparison for launch costs. It may also be possible to spend a fraction on the spacecraft for this type of flight also. It is hard to pin down those costs without a defined mission. The question again is what would be a viable business plan to justify spending this type of money on a mission. It is fun to dream, but at some point we all must have a worthwhile purpose for what we do. Any ideas on that front?
Something to consider though is that you are spending $5-10M on a rocket that burns up on reentry, this is compared to $60-100k of camera equipment. A suborbital near space mission would be almost trivial in comparison for launch costs. It may also be possible to spend a fraction on the spacecraft for this type of flight also. It is hard to pin down those costs without a defined mission. The question again is what would be a viable business plan to justify spending this type of money on a mission. It is fun to dream, but at some point we all must have a worthwhile purpose for what we do. Any ideas on that front?