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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

simulating natural daylight in small rooms without windows

J

Jay Cowley

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I was recently challenged to re-create natural daylight in a room, as if the light was coming in from windows, although those windows weren't actually there and you didn't see them in the frame.

Was finding my bounced light just looked fake and it also looked like there was a light just off frame when i used kinos.
Are there any common mistakes made when trying to create this type of look with these challenges?
 
If you don't have a daylight source, use something harsh and direct with barn doors, like a Redhead, and and CTB, and aim it at the background or slightly on the subject. It will look like it's the sun coming from the window...

This was shot after dark with a HMI coming from the door of the store:

431480_10150631285398762_19666043761_8808136_181086222_n.jpg
 
Hey Jay, good question and welcome to Reduser!

One of the problems is that real sunlight will bring the ambient light levels up a lot in a room with a window, because the light is strong and it will bounce around. From my experience, the bigger the lamp the more real it feels. Kinos won't do it for wide shots. There just isn't enough throw to feel like sunlight. If you don't have any big lights, use your biggest lamp for your direct sunlight and another one for ambient light (bouncing off the ceiling or a poly board). If your scene feels fake, there probably just isn't enough ambient light, which is what makes it feel like a street light coming in the window instead of the sun. Having a tall stand will help too, because the sun is usually high in the sky and the angle of light helps sell the effect. Building a simple frame from flags to simulate the window will also help, even if you diffuse the light first. The more space in between the lamp and your fake window made of flags, the better. Color temperature is another key element in faking sunlight. An overcast day should be cooler and heavily diffused, while a sunny morning scene would be warmer with little to no diffusion (like the example posted by Lewis). I hope my advice helps, but experiment yourself with different lamps and setups. Lighting is one of those things you never fully learn. Its a constant learning process and probably the most difficult part of cinematography. Not a shoot goes by that I don't learn something new, and I can't imagine that will ever change. Also, the "Ask David Mullen Anything" thread is an extremely valuable source of lighting tips. I can't stress enough how much knowledge is in that thread. Give it a quick read :) Good luck Jay.
 
Bouncing a hard light into a mirror on a wall out of shot is worth exploring.
 
I have the same situation in an upcoming studio shoot. I´m thinking large source through diffusion through a window-size frame (I´m getting one built).
1. Could I swap the one large lamp with several 1kW par cans fitted close together? (It would help on budget)
2. There´s no ceiling in my case. Would it make sense to add a large soft source overhead?
 
Create visual cues, paint with light.

Using Kinos and other soft sources makes it an overcast day. The mind is going to accept that daylight is responsible for lighting the scene only if there is a believable possible source (a window - not a hallway). Daylight coming through a window should be directional - everything else builds off of it. You should not have the outdoor sources appear warmer than the indoors with the exception of dawn & dusk magic hours.

Once the outdoor source is in place, add a tungsten practical in the scene to provide a contrasted look from the daylight balanced source.
Again, the warmer color temp of an indoor practical reinforces the visual cue of indoor versus outdoor light.

Depending on the presumed environment, add shadows:

With the 5000+K source light on the other side, use a tree branch holder (check the Matthews Studio Equipment catalog) to hold an actual tree branch. Then add a small fan to gently move the branch - amplifying the illusion of it being outdoors.
Look at using a Dedolight or Leko with a pattern holder. There are hundreds of gobos that can be inserted to project focusable patterns. For example, simulating an upper floor office may call for vertical blinds while another location may call for curtains. If you use a larger source, you can use a motorized unit that can simulate clouds moving (that works great in combination with the tree branch).
Many of those are DMX-512 controllable so you can easily change the speed.

Plenty of other tricks - all depends on the scene you are trying to create.
 
Realize this may be dead but are you going for a cloudy or sunny day look? If cloudy definitely bounce. Shoot some HMI's into a 12x of ultrabounce and position out of frame. It'll give you nice soft even light. Obviously, the bigger the source the softer the light and more wrap. If you're going for sunny day just go direct with HMI or CTB some tungsten sources. Possibly a combination of the two if you wanna fake a sunny day...

Hope that answers your question, sorry if it doesnt
 
Yes I was trying to achieve a bright day with no direct sunlight entering the room, just indirect light entering the windows. if i bounced an HMI off frame, wouldn't this spill too much? I always worry about flagging and directing soft light in small rooms. thats why I thought the kinos could be good because they were easier to direct and control spill
 
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