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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Wow! THR disses Red, rebuttal needed

That reporter was fed the article, and didn't bother to do any research herself.

Entertainment reporters aren't journalists. Such a shame.
 
Jeremy Torrie said:
That reporter was fed the article, and didn't bother to do any research herself.

Entertainment reporters aren't journalists. Such a shame.
Click to expand...

Carolyn Giardina has been reporting on the tech end of our industry for a number of years and attends essentially every event, major and minor, that we have. She is very knowledgeable, completely equipment and manufacturer agnostic, and writes on the subject at hand. Both the F65 and the Dalsa were uncompressed 4K cameras. Red has never been that. That's a simple fact. Reporters report facts, not emotionally based opinions.
 
Mike, basing the article's ignorance of RED on "uncompressed" is just a semantic trick. They may as well have just talked about 4k cameras above a certain price and ignored RED on price too. That said, we're really happy that Sony are finally in the world of 4k acquisition, just like they've had 4k projectors for a while. There is always something special about 4k imagery - the smoothness of tonality and no need to over-egg the sharpness pudding. Sony's 4k demonstrates those aspects just as RED's cameras demonstrate that, and getting that message out to a wider audience is good for us all.

Graeme
 
Graeme Nattress said:
Mike, basing the article's ignorance of RED on "uncompressed" is just a semantic trick. They may as well have just talked about 4k cameras above a certain price and ignored RED on price too. That said, we're really happy that Sony are finally in the world of 4k acquisition, just like they've had 4k projectors for a while. There is always something special about 4k imagery - the smoothness of tonality and no need to over-egg the sharpness pudding. Sony's 4k demonstrates those aspects just as RED's cameras demonstrate that, and getting that message out to a wider audience is good for us all.

Graeme
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Graeme, you know Carolyn (at least I think you do) just as I do. She is not in any way "ignorant of Red," and to imply such is pretty insulting. All writers are free to report what they see as they see it, and they are not obligated to mention every device that could possibly be included in every article. For the mainstream industry, the arrival of a Sony 4K camera product is pretty significant, and most likely just as much of a lightning rod for development of 4K compatible companion products, such as displays, as Red was, if not more so. Sony has a much greater reach into both the mainstream production industry and the consumer market, and thus an awful lot of influence. THAT was likely the reason for Carolyn's piece.

Not mentioning something is certainly not the same as "dissing" it, which is what is implied by this thread.
 
How can one not write for a major media publication like THR and not mention Red in the same breath as 4K, especially if she is as acknowledgeable as you claim her to be?

I don't know anything of her previous writings so this one seemed to be tilted as a puff piece for Sony. And maybe because those of us on Reduser have had intimate knowledge of 4K for years means we assume everyone knows about this resolution threshold. But I'm pretty sure if anyone did a google search of 4K filmmaking Red would be at the top of the page.

If it weren't for Red there would be nothing to report as far as 4K acquisition for potentially years to come; Sony was content with 1080 for soooo long -their cameras were high margins and their VTR's continue to be, even though they max out at 2K, yet somehow they did a 4K projector.

My point is Red has been -and continues to do so with Dragon- to push the digital acquisition and playback envelope, and as someone who has invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in HD (and beyond) hardware over 15 years only to be frustrated by the hold back of technological developments, I'm glad they're doing what they are. But she should know to write at least a sentence referencing the pioneering work of Red.
 
This reads like a press release, much like the VNR's that are NOT news either but corporate PR under the guise of news.

"Professionals may remember a prior true 4K digital cinematography camera that was on the market for Hollywood cinematographers. However, the camera, from a company called Dalsa, was pricey and perhaps a bit ahead of the curve, and Dalsa abandoned the technology a few years ago."

The fact that this paragraph mentions 4K and that Dalsa "abandoned it", without any mention of RED, who put 4K on the map for all, smacks of a hidden agenda. The error by omission rather than commission is still just as wrong. If an industry journalist reporting on 4K cameras chose to mention Dalsa and not mention RED, who Sony is now competing with for 4K camera sales, then it screams BS.
 
M Most said:
Graeme, you know Carolyn (at least I think you do) just as I do. She is not in any way "ignorant of Red," and to imply such is pretty insulting....
Click to expand...

M Most said:
...Sony has a much greater reach into both the mainstream production industry and the consumer market, and thus an awful lot of influence. THAT was likely the reason for Carolyn's piece....
Click to expand...

Well..not sure how you get any more mainstream production than Pirates of the Caribbean 4 shot in 4k measured resolution...all on a camera body that came out back in 2007 after all...not a new kid on the block anymore.

But Mike since you know Carolyn perphaps you might ask her to log in and explain why Red One was ignored in this article. Know she was
a long time editor of Film and Video magazine so finding this Hollywood Reporter article odd.

http://www.ibc.org/page.cfm/link=126

Journalist Carolyn Giardina has been covering entertainment technology for 15 years including all aspects of production, post, VFX and animation, as well as DTV, d-cinema and stereoscopic 3D. Based in Los Angeles, Carolyn's credits as an editor and reporter include The Hollywood Reporter, the IBC Daily, British Cinematographer, Shoot, Film and Video.
Carolyn has reported on the The Hollywood Reporter syndicated cable programme. She serves on the Hollywood Post Alliance Board of Directors, and chairs its annual HPA Awards.
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Life's too short to get worked up about an article that doesn't mention RED. There have been countless articles about RED in the trades over the past 4 years. We have to be realistic that other cameras are going to get their due as well. Now, if they say something that's not true about RED in an article then it would give reason to question things, but not sure this is really a battle to pick in this case. And to be honest, I'm not bothered by it. I know what RED is. I have an idea of where they are going in the next couple of years. I know less about Sony and their plans. Ultimately, I will need to see camera first hand to know more about it, so articles just give a bit of a head start. But I don't always take them as gospel. I use my eyes for that. I know emotion plays a factor, so I'm not dissing you guys at all, just trying to separate the emotional from the business side. :-)
 
Steve Sherrick said:
just trying to separate the emotional from the business side. :-)
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I agree Steve.

My point is that sometimes journalists don't report the real news, but can be involved or influenced, knowingly or not, in "creating" news.
 
Robert Frank said:
I agree Steve.

My point is that sometimes journalists don't report the real news, but can be involved or influenced, knowingly or not, in "creating" news.
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I understand where you are coming from. All one has to do is look at current news stations (won't mention by name but you probably know which ones I'm talking about) and you'll see some stuff that makes you cringe, knowing there are agendas at play. When it comes to technology, I have learned that specs, news articles, photos, etc only tell so much. It's only when I get deep into things hands on, and talk with people who work with the tools on a regular basis that I get the full info I need. There are some great resources out there in terms of trade mags. I've learned a lot through those too, but a Hollywood Reporter article probably wouldn't be my go to resource.
 
M Most said:
Carolyn Giardina has been reporting on the tech end of our industry for a number of years and attends essentially every event, major and minor, that we have. She is very knowledgeable, completely equipment and manufacturer agnostic, and writes on the subject at hand. Both the F65 and the Dalsa were uncompressed 4K cameras. Red has never been that. That's a simple fact. Reporters report facts, not emotionally based opinions.
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The article demonstrates selective ignorance.
 
The title of this thread is more accurate than that article. To talk about the biggest advancement in digital cinema acquisition but not mention the one company championing it is a clear insult. This reads as a clear press release and not as a true report. From her cidentials she clearly is a well versed journo which makes even more of a dis.
 
Steve Sherrick said:
....There are some great resources out there in terms of trade mags. I've learned a lot through those too, but a Hollywood Reporter article probably wouldn't be my go to resource.
Click to expand...

Of course not...don't think anyone here subscribes to the Hollywood Reporter or Variety.

Those are strictly trade mags that every studio gets and passes around daily
so they can follow the revolving doors and musical chairs that occur at the major studios.
You need to read those magazines so you know who is who...and what not.

Therefore the very few equipment/tech. articles they do print are likely the sole print
info. source that studio executives may rely on. Which can lead to"..Sony has a new camera out..
it's newer and more expensive that the others..it must be better..."
Which leads to myths and ideas that directors and Dp's have to deal with.
 
Steve Das said:
Of course not...don't think anyone here subscribes to the Hollywood Reporter or Variety.

Those are strictly trade mags that every studio gets and passes around daily
so they can follow the revolving doors and musical chairs that occur at the major studios.
You need to read those magazines so you know who is who...and what not.

Therefore the very few equipment/tech. articles they do print are likely the sole print
info. source that studio executives may rely on. Which can lead to"..Sony has a new camera out..
it's newer and more expensive that the others..it must be better..."
Which leads to myths and ideas that directors and Dp's have to deal with.
Click to expand...
I know this is true to a certain extent but it extends even beyond these trade mags. Without getting into too many details there has been a bias against RED in certain segments of the industry, some of which had nothing to do with camera specs or trade magazine articles. RED survived a lot of it and has changed some people's minds. Execs look through accounting books, DPs look through cameras. In my opinion they should have a lot of the final say when it comes to choosing a camera system. If budget becomes an issue, DP should have say in alternate camera system. Execs should do what they do best. The DPs and Techs are on the frontlines and are the ones informed about this stuff and don't need a Hollywood Reporter article.

But alas, I know reality is you are probably correct, and there is a bit of influence from these studio trades. Wishing it weren't so.
 
Mike, no I don't know the writer of the article. All I can go on are the words of the article and how it mentions "true 4k" and that somehow both Dalsa and the Sony are worthy of that epithet and by omission, RED's offerings in the digital cinema realm are not even though although the measured resolution of the Dalsa was lower than the RED. Obviously the Epic is way beyond the Dalsa in measured resolution.

If the article had only mentioned Sony then I'd agree with you - it's a news article about their great news, and that's fine. But the mention of the Dalsa as well shows that the article is attempting to put the news from Sony in some form of perspective, yet by omitting the RED, the perspective is rather skewed.

As for the article dissing RED - it does not. It omits RED. I can see how that omission can be perceived though.

Graeme
 
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