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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

HDRx scoop...

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Expletive here!!!

Expletive here!!!

Jannard said:
Frank... given your amount of pixel peeping I have decided not to post any HDRx™ R3Ds until we are done. I can just hear the critical picking on every detail if we post now... stuff we are working on but the industry will be forced to see "what it doesn't do" rather than what it does. These posts are very telling to me. Give the early stuff to the pros who always seem to find a way to use and embrace it and keep it out of the hands of the rest until it is finished or it will get picked to death.

Jim
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Nice one Frank!! Expletive here!!!
 
Jannard said:
None... these algorithms won't work in camera. I think you can say goodbye to eHDR™. No final judgment but I'm leaning that way. Think "pro".
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I'm not sure if I remember this correctly, but wasn't eHDR unalterable in post? If so, that would seem to go against the flexibilty of RAW file workflow.

Save eHDR for the REDphone(™). :smile5:
 
Jannard said:
Frank... given your amount of pixel peeping I have decided not to post any HDRx™ R3Ds until we are done. I can just hear the critical picking on every detail if we post now... stuff we are working on but the industry will be forced to see "what it doesn't do" rather than what it does. These posts are very telling to me. Give the early stuff to the pros who always seem to find a way to use and embrace it and keep it out of the hands of the rest until it is finished or it will get picked to death.

Jim
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Is there some way to allow those of us who want to embrace the opportunity & potential to share in the stuff that's in progress?

Maybe a registered forum for us who are Epic-X reservation-holders so you can post R3D's and samples? That way we can be on top of where the camera's at while shielding it a bit from the naysayers.
 
Trevor Meier said:
Is there some way to allow those of us who want to embrace the opportunity & potential to share in the stuff that's in progress?

Maybe a registered forum for us who are Epic-X reservation-holders so you can post R3D's and samples? That way we can be on top of where the camera's at while shielding it a bit from the naysayers.
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:iagree: I would welcome the chance to be able to contribute constructive feedback. I've been involved in a number of hardware and software beta programs, NDA's and all, for major corporations.

The way I see the development process, especially with RED, it is like going to your friends garage to see what he's working on, whether it's his race car, surfboards that he's building, furniture, software... or the best movie camera.

And if he shows you something totally new, never been done before, off the scale advances, and he just miraculously doubled the horsepower of his motor earlier that day, it's not helpful to point out and stay focused on that the idle is a little rough. Sorry, car guy here...
 
Thanks Graeme, I cannot wait to play with this new feature.
Thanks Jim.
 
In the thirty years I've dedicated to fine art, this is the first camera I have ever coveted. I thought I was beyond all that - and I suppose I was till now. ( :
 
It's almost like when one guy in school gets the others in trouble ... :mad:

But yah, I think people are onto something -- perhaps having a special area that's not public where people can go to give Red constructive feedback. Because it seems like the danger in pixel-peeping is not whether something is seen, but more that something (that is not a real issue) can be distorted and then spread around into a rumor or worse -- a myth. I understand Jim's reluctance since some of these myths have not been easy for Red to shed, and are just now finally dying years later :(
 
Jannard said:
So Graeme came up with another advancement today for Magic Motion. It deals with the most difficult situations of bright highlights moving quickly against a dark background. I tried it on some of my older HDRx™ footage and was blown away... but I wanted to try something more difficult. At the house we have a gas fireplace. While not the most natural looking "read a book by the fireplace" fire, it forces out the flame with rapid changes. Very difficult motion to deal with, especially with two exposures. And usually something in fire is near clipped or white in the center. The perfect test. I used HDRx™ +3.

Here is the result. I did no grading whatsoever. I just pushed the "Magic Button"...

Jim

http://red.cachefly.net/flame.mov
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this is really remarkable! look forward to getting one!!
 
Jannard said:
Give the early stuff to the pros who always seem to find a way to use and embrace it and keep it out of the hands of the rest until it is finished or it will get picked to death.
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I obviously understand why you don't want people over-analyzing an image from an Alpha/Beta product, I really do. However, implying that someone isn't "pro" just because the are analyzing it is a little much.

I know that I'll be crucified for this comment, but it seems that RED is a little too sensitive. Criticism is great for a product, and although it can sting, it needs to be heard.
 
yes but you rarely(it does occur I know) see or have to deal with criticism of an unfinished product (from customer/general populace) especially a revolutionary one where if you did find yourself explaining issues you might very well give away some of the things that made it innovative in the first place and give your competitors a heads up.

honestly I don't think it's that, I think it has more to do with the fact that criticism, especially of a unfinished product has already hurt red and they are still recovering from those early misconceptions of the red one and their company as a whole. the last thing they need is to repeat the whole process over again, and I think they are doing a great job of not repeating it.

I always have to remind myself that most of these downsides or sensitivities don't even exist in the first place with most companies as they are no where near as transparent as red is, and that I and we all are very lucky that they have the mentality they do. I for one find it refreshing in today's corporate climate.

Though we all have a right to an opinion (though I'm not sure mine is exactly correct) I think with most things it's how you approach it, criticism is helpful but most often it is only polite to do it when asked and if not to be respectful and take into account the context it was presented to you in.

play nice, and as always have a good one!
 
Michael Dearworth said:
I obviously understand why you don't want people over-analyzing an image from an Alpha/Beta product, I really do. However, implying that someone isn't "pro" just because the are analyzing it is a little much.

I know that I'll be crucified for this comment, but it seems that RED is a little too sensitive. Criticism is great for a product, and although it can sting, it needs to be heard.
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It isn't about analyzing... it is about reputation. You can look at this post as what is coming... or what it is. The intent was what is coming. To post an R3D and get this picked apart (which is the intent of said poster) does a disservice to the program. The 1st thing that goes around is "what it isn't"... and that word spreads like wildfire. Example...

RED ONEs overheat. That came from a post I made when Soderbergh's pre-production cameras got an error message that the camera was overheating on Ché the very 1st day of shooting. I heard it and I posted it... because we are transparent. That perception lingers even today. The fact is that the RED ONE is the single best performing camera in the industry ESPECIALLY in the heat. As it turns out... we set the heat alarm too low in the camera. There was no overheating on Soderbergh's cameras even back then. Did you know that?

So let us post an R3D of a brand new algorithm that Graeme came up with THAT DAY and have it picked apart. That makes sense. The point is that we have solved a problem. But it is not ready to be picked apart. We'll wait until it is... pretty simple stuff.

This transparent thing is starting to wear me out. No other company does it. I now fully understand why. Customers here now feel entitled to every detail, every reason why we do something. People want to know why so and so got a camera before they did. I seriously am rethinking how much info I will put out.

Jim
 
Michael Dearworth said:
I obviously understand why you don't want people over-analyzing an image from an Alpha/Beta product, I really do. However, implying that someone isn't "pro" just because the are analyzing it is a little much.

I know that I'll be crucified for this comment, but it seems that RED is a little too sensitive. Criticism is great for a product, and although it can sting, it needs to be heard.
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I think you're missing the point. Analyzing footage in development stages is probably better left to those who understand how to keep that footage in context with where in the development cycle is the technology that is being demonstrated.
 
I'd have to say that the loud minor few usually always let these things happen through their lack of ability to comprehend. But don't let it wear you down, let it go like water off a ducks back. It got us to here today didn't it? And can you truly say to yourself, Epic, HDRx™ etc.. would be here if you weren't transparent in the first place?
 
Transparency sucks right now.

Jim
 
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