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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Epic-S or RedOne-MX??

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Kalechi Noel

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Hey, we're a production company based out in NYC, and we are in the market to buy our first Red. We've been renting the R1-MX which has been great to us thus far and were offered the option to purchase it at $20k with 3 batteries, and Charger, Tripod etc

I heard recently that the Epic-S was announced, have 5k and HDR and would cost only 12k. Is this a better camera to buy than the used R1-MX package being offered at $20k???
 
You'll need to kit out that Epic-S brain, so you'll probably spend about $20k or more on that package.
Plus, if you need it now, R1-MX is your only choice. Epic-S won't be available for anyone without an R1 until summer.
 
If you are not capable of regenerating those 20k with an MX (which s a very good deal BTW) before the Epic-S is available, I guess neither is a good deal for you...
 
Thanks for the quick replies. Yes, we are in the process of raising the $20k in funds. The question is, if we buy the R1-mx next month ($20k), will we regret not waiting and buying the Epic-S ($12k + $8k accessories). What advantages if any will the R1-mx have?
 
The advantage is simply 6-12 months of use vs waiting.

Sorry.

Didn't mean to come off too harsh...

I am familiar with your problem.

Thing is:
It is better to be in production than to wait.

If you cannot get your R1MX into production, you're probably better off waiting...
 
The camera is as valuable as you make it. Yes, the camera has market value, but it also has the value you assign to other things about it like, owning it outright means it always generates money on your shoots (if you are dictating the tool).
Plenty of great stuff has been filmed with M sensor RED's since the MX came out. To those people that does not make the tool less valuable. The backend of the RED program (RCX) has improved all RED footage not matter what sensor.

The EPIC-s only comes after EPIC-M and X and that means stage 2 and 3. It's also going to be slightly handcuffed and possibly (no one knows) not have as many features as a 4K RED one MX does now have.

8K on accesorries is alos conservative.

David
 
@Gunliek, we're constantly working. We have a few projects already lined up (Music Videos etc). Problem is, we are constantly renting this R1-MX at $500 per day as well. For the upcoming projects, we will be using a rented R1-MX, unless we decide to own it. The $20k is a sacrifice we are willing to make in 2011. Just want to be sure we're investing in the right baby!
 
I Think, for a company, this is all about costs...
Does it cost you more to rent the R1 mx during 6-12 months?(still generating money, then buy Epic-S)
Or does it cost more to buy it now and not sure to get money back quickly?
Anyway I think you won't be disapointed!
 
Kalechi Noel said:
The question is, if we buy the R1-mx next month ($20k), will we regret not waiting and buying the Epic-S ($12k + $8k accessories).
Click to expand...

The Red-One M-X is actually $25,000 now, and then you will need a CF Module* or a SSD module for it.

http://www.red.com/store/red-one/product/red-one-s35-mysterium-x

David Battistella said:
8K on accessories is also conservative.
Click to expand...

What David is saying is very true with both the Red One and the Epic line. A lot of people are caught thinking a camera body is basically all they will need.

Add to this ... What LCD or EVF will you be using? Take a look at their availability.

*Keep in mind that Red is starting to move away from CF cards. You could most likely get the CF module right away, but that is not a good long term investment.

The SSD module for the R1 will be a much longer wait. Trust me on this. :crying:

Why don't you guys rent for now, and ultimately save your money for an Epic with SSD module? There are a lot of M-Xed Red Ones in the NYC area.

By the time Epics are widely available to non-Red owners, you might very well have saved enough for an Epic-X.

Best of luck to you.
 
Well... Then the calculus is quite simple...

Can you have 20 working days on the R1 MX over the next 9 months?

If the answer is:

Yes or more...

Then buy

If the answer is

No or less...

Then rent...

You must be preparedto sell at 50% of purchase price or less within a year...
 
@Peter... @Everyone....Buying USED R1-MX, for $20k with following accessories:
Tripod
Matte
CF MOdule, 2 gb cards
320gb Red DRive, Red Cradle
5" LCD with arm, 2 sets of rods.

Is this deal too good to walk away from?
 
Gunleik Groven said:
Well... Then the calculus is quite simple...
Can you have 20 working days on the R1 MX over the next 9 months?

If the answer is:
Yes or more...Then buy

If the answer is
No or less...Then rent...

You must be preparedto sell at 50% of purchase price or less within a year...
Click to expand...

That's it. Good advice.
 
IMHO ... That deal seems a little too good to be true.

Just be very careful.

Make sure it did not "fall off the back of a truck".

Ask to run the serial number with Red. Perhaps you should even request a check up.
 
To me that deal doesn't sound too good to be true as it's most likely executed already for the upgrade.

A lot of people are selling executed R1s for $10-$15k depending on accessories.

In my opinion this is a good deal and if you think you will use it 20 times before July then it's great.

You can always get an Epic-S and have two cameras, renting the R1 out for $300 a day until the end of time.

I own an R1 and it was the smartest thing I have ever done. Having 24-7 access to it rather than renting a couple of times a month has been fantastic and allowed me to use it on everything.

As long as you have figured out a plan for lenses, I say go for it and don't look back.
 
which tripod and mattebox.
an o'connor head with legs can be up to 10 000 usd
a mattebox up to 4000 usd.
anyway i wouldnt buy! (of course if it is an oconnor and arri mb, buy, but i assume its not)
i would go to the guy where you rent from and say i give u 3500 for 10 rental days.
thats it.
if he denies post here that you need a red for 10 rental days in the new york area.
you will find one.
lets say you know you have 20 days this year. say 6000 for 20 days.
you will find some.
at the end you will want to have an Epic.
so instead of buying a red mx now and try to sell it in one year (dont forget the maintanance costs over the next 12 months too) just rent and buy brand new what you like.
edit: red was the smartest investment for me too, that was 3 years ago, today i would
wait and buy an epic.
 
@Peter... it's DP I work with. Ive Been using his camera for last 2 years. He's obviously looking upgrade to Epic, so he knows he'll get more selling privately to me.

@Steve @Gunleik, Def won't have 20 jobs over next 9 months. But aern't some deals worth the sacrifice.... ??
 
Kalechi Noel said:
Thanks for the quick replies. Yes, we are in the process of raising the $20k in funds. The question is, if we buy the R1-mx next month ($20k), will we regret not waiting and buying the Epic-S ($12k + $8k accessories). What advantages if any will the R1-mx have?
Click to expand...

How much will you shoot/rent in the first three months on 2011?
 
Epic-S VS RedOne-MX

Epic-S VS RedOne-MX

Mark L. Pederson said:
How much will you shoot/rent in the first three months on 2011?
Click to expand...

@Mark.... Only 4 Jobs scheduled until March. Things always pickup in summer though especially with Music Videos etc.... as well as 2 personal shorts I'd like to do...
 
Kalechi Noel said:
@Mark.... Only 4 Jobs scheduled until March. Things always pickup in summer though especially with Music Videos etc.... as well as 2 personal shorts I'd like to do...
Click to expand...

Well ... R1MX is a GREAT camera. It shot Pirates of the Caribbean 4.

But I will tell you ... EPIC is incredible. I think that the entire world (Jim included) is STILL under-estimating what the demand for EPICs is going to be.

Doesn't sound like you are just sitting on the cash right now anyway - and even though it's a very good deal TODAY - I don't think come April you will feel that way.

My personal advice - keep renting MX - save up - jump on EPIC S. And sleep with it next to you in bed.

My 2 cents.
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
Well ... R1MX is a GREAT camera. It shot Pirates of the Caribbean 4.

But I will tell you ... EPIC is incredible. I think that the entire world (Jim included) is STILL under-estimating what the demand for EPICs is going to be.

Doesn't sound like you are just sitting on the cash right now anyway - and even though it's a very good deal TODAY - I don't think come April you will feel that way.

My personal advice - keep renting MX - save up - jump on EPIC S. And sleep with it next to you in bed.

My 2 cents.
Click to expand...

@Mark you are saying that the Epic-S at $12k is a better camera than R1MX currently out??
 
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