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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

What's the Most FUTURE-PROOF Cine Lens?

POV

POV

Now that's certainly a POV:001_tongue:
 
OptiTek said:
IMO Zeiss couldn't make a good zoom if their life depended on it.

Before you flame me to death::emote_couch:
I've serviced ad repaired lenses for 25 years.
Click to expand...

Jacek, in your opinion who makes the best zoom lens? The Cooke zoom ...

http://www.zgc.com/webstore.nsf/products/cooke_cxxzoom

Though this is fairly limited in focal length, and they don't seem to have any
others for 35mm.

Just curious ...

Anthony
 
AnthonyFlores said:
Jacek, in your opinion who makes the best zoom lens? ...
Click to expand...

"best" means different things to different people. For Jacek the best lens is the one that he can charge most for to repair, no? :smilielol5:

For other people, "best" may mean, small, big, fast, slow, sharp, soft, inexpensive, expensive, having a specific "look", well build, doesn't breathe, good mechanics, having xxx mount, ...and just abouty infinite number of features. It is like asking what is the best car.

I don't like zooms because, in general, they are heavy, slow and distort...unless I need to get two different focal length shots with little time to spare...then I'd love to have a zoom...and almost every time a different one too :)
 
AnthonyFlores said:
I'm working on a business plan/executive summary for a production studio next year that will do 1/3 non-profit, 1/3 narrative/features, and 1/3 marketing commercial work.
Click to expand...
a business plan that does 1/3 non-profit? Recipe for disaster.
 
George Butterfield said:
a business plan that does 1/3 non-profit? Recipe for disaster.
Click to expand...

Haha, depends on what "non-profit means" means. If he is just talking about a lot of the job offers I get these days. They are not charity, they just are not profitable.:smile5:
 
George Butterfield said:
a business plan that does 1/3 non-profit? Recipe for disaster.
Click to expand...

LOL, naw that just means there will be a non-profit division that once per
quarter, takes charity or non-profit organization and makes a short film
about what they're doing (for free). This will be a piece they can use
to generate an emotional response in people, and ideally attract much
more funding.

The non-profit and the "for profit" business have no connection, other than
that they will share some of the same equipment, and also a portion
of the profits will go to making sure these non-profit films are properly
subsidized.

It's like a form of tithing ...
 
Steven-Marc C. said:
Speaking of zooms, the new Zeiss Lightweight Zoom seems interesting. Would love to see some kind of comparison test with Red's RPZ.
Click to expand...

I've used the LWZ, and I liked it. Sharper than old primes like the Supers and Standards. Reasonably fast.

Basically, just what you would expect from an Arri/Zeiss product.

Haven't tried the 17-50, so can't comment on a comparison.
 
Pawel Achtel said:
"...
For other people, "best" may mean, small, big, fast, slow, sharp, soft, inexpensive, expensive, having a specific "look", well build, doesn't breathe, good mechanics, having xxx mount, ...and just abouty infinite number of features..."
Click to expand...

So true, so false :) :) :)

Antoine
 
Best zooms

Best zooms

AnthonyFlores said:
Jacek, in your opinion who makes the best zoom lens? The Cooke zoom ...

http://www.zgc.com/webstore.nsf/products/cooke_cxxzoom

Though this is fairly limited in focal length, and they don't seem to have any
others for 35mm.

Just curious ...

Anthony
Click to expand...
Rather than beat around the bushes I'll be brief- Angenieux- no question about it.
Back in '87 I decided on the Cooke 18-100 against angies 17-102 for what's now Panavision New York and it was the best choice. Today the Optimo line is the industry leader.
Including the Rougue line. Welcome with open arms on any film set budget large or small.
From the service/repair stand point they are also friendly and not so expensive to maintain.(Yes Pawel:reddevil:)
Other than being intimately familiar with these lenses I have no connection/benefits from Angenieux
 
Angenieux Optimos are the industry standard and cut nicely with Carl Zeiss Master Primes, Ultra Primes, Cookes and Panavision Primos.

But all of these professional glass have huge issues with flares for example with the sun direct lights or car night lights (@ wide open) either.

The latest optical innovations using an aspherical glass elements and also new coating technologies still didn't remove some of the main lens aberrations (SEIDEL's five aberrations).

In the future it remains to see if so called professional cine glass with a high end mechanical performance but not any more optical will survive the latest industry trend of cheaper financial models.

The latest DSLR revolution just showed to everybody in this industry how good results and what is possible to achieve with using still photo glass in production.

Even Carls Zeiss and Angenieux offer today some of their latest high end cine glass with still photo mounts (Canon EOS, Nikon F,...).
 
Thanks Sanjin.

Also, when I started the thread I asked about lenses that would work on
the FF Epic and Scarlet, and one thing I never knew existed was 65mm
lenses that Arri/Zeiss developed for the Phantom 65.

Abel rents them here:

http://www.abelcine.com/store/ARRI-Zeiss-Maxi-PL-Primes-for-Phantom-65/

I wonder if they are the same image quality as the Master Primes.

Obviously, for a VERY small market segment at this point. But maybe
as the FF Red Models and then the 645 and 617 come out, there will be
more available like this.

Anthony
 
Leica21mm-C_on_Epic.jpg

From FDTimes:Leica_Report V2, page 13. >>>

EPIC lightweight cine digital camera 2.3 kg (5 lbs) + Leica Summilux-C lens lightweight & fast cine lenses 1.6 - 1.8 kg (3.5-4.0 lbs) = 3.9 - 4.8 kg (8.5 - 9.0 lbs)
 
If you want to own your own lenses and still be able to pay the bills, I would seriously consider the RPP's. They are stellar lenses for the price.

If price is no object than these would be my choice:

1. Primes: Zeiss Master Primes. They are the gold standard. Period.
2. Zooms: Angenieux. The gold standard of zooms. Period.

About Leica. I am not sure why everyone is worshiping Leica's feet with the C primes. Will they be good? I'm sure but I would wait for them to establish themselves in the industry before dropping down six figures for the complete set. Why does everyone assume that Leica releases gold every time? They have had some phenomenal products, some good products and some bad products, just like every other company. I would bet money that they will be stellar but I would wait till they shoot some high profile material before I purchased. Besides, good luck getting a set anytime soon.
 
Andrew Rieger said:
If you want to own your own lenses and still be able to pay the bills, I would seriously consider the RPP's. They are stellar lenses for the price.

If price is no object than these would be my choice:

1. Primes: Zeiss Master Primes. They are the gold standard. Period.
2. Zooms: Angenieux. The gold standard of zooms. Period.

About Leica. I am not sure why everyone is worshiping Leica's feet with the C primes. Will they be good? I'm sure but I would wait for them to establish themselves in the industry before dropping down six figures for the complete set. Why does everyone assume that Leica releases gold every time? They have had some phenomenal products, some good products and some bad products, just like every other company. I would bet money that they will be stellar but I would wait till they shoot some high profile material before I purchased. Besides, good luck getting a set anytime soon.
Click to expand...


Andrew, well I think some people are buying on the basis that Leica glass
has been incredibly stellar on their still lenses ... and even more because
it was Leica glass in most (maybe all?) of the legendary Panavision lenses.

So this is almost like being able to buy Primos brand new ;-)

But I get your point. It's a HUGE investment for something that's yet to
be battle-tested on feature films.

I personally (if money is no object) would probably go in the direction of
the Cooke 5i series. I know some people hate the "warmth" or the notion
of the lens adding anything to what's shot (rather than doing it in post)...

But the build quality, glass and technology seems amazing, and I
personally love the "Cooke look" from the films I've seen where they are
used. I believe they are being used for Scorcese's first 3D film right now.

Again, I agree with you on the RPP's. Unless I got outside funding or
started to rake in millions of dollars from projects, I will most likely invest
in those ...

Thanks,

Anthony
 
Evin Grant said:
Anthony, all those lenses use the Hasselblad formulas. They are very good but not unique designs. I've yet so see the barrels but I'd imagine they are nice like all of Zeiss's cinema lenses.
Click to expand...

Interesting about Hasslebad. I guess part of me is curious about whether
these lenses are essentially "Master Primes" (in build and image quality)
with the only difference being the larger coverage area.

From the daily rental price ($2000) I would assume so. And if that's the
case, it seems smart for anyone getting a set of Master Primes to get
these instead ... and be able to use them on all future Epic cameras.

But maybe they're not exactly the same as the Master Primes ...

Anthony
 
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AnthonyFlores said:
...But maybe they're not exactly the same as the Master Primes ...
Click to expand...

Optically and mechanically I have no reason to believe that they are substantially different. I like the smaller size of the Leicas.

But, my first hand experience with both brands is that there is substantial difference in customer support. Not only Arri has a world wide support network, but their service is second to none. Leica's is just none. :mad2:
 
Pawel Achtel said:
Optically and mechanically I have no reason to believe that they are substantially different. I like the smaller size of the Leicas.

But, my first hand experience with both brands is that there is substantial difference in customer support. Not only Arri has a world wide support network, but their service is second to none. Leica's is just none. :mad2:
Click to expand...

Pawel,

your experience with Leica customer service has nothing to do with Leica just because you wanted to service the lenses that were mechanically remade and redesigned from third party...

Please don't try to spread the FUD that Leica tried out to sell people expensive set of perfect cine lenses and leave them without a proper customer service.

If the name of Otto Nemenz International, Inc., that is one of the Leica partners in making of their Leica-C lenses, doesn't tell you anything about the quality service

then in that case nobody can help you with this kind of thinking anyway... :biggrin:
 
Hi Guy's

The Maxi PL set is an old set from when Arri was chasing 65mm with the 765. Not a high performance set for s35mm frame sizes. Nice set for large format, but there are a few other options.

for me the Master Primes, while excellent, miss one of the reasons that you would use a prime - when size and weight are important. Cameras keep getting smaller....

I've done some informal testing with a few of the Leica's and they were really good. I'm sure the retail service centers and the ones that will support the cine lenses will be different with different attitudes.

In Lenvy we trust.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com
 
Matt Uhry said:
Hi Guy's

The Maxi PL set is an old set from when Arri was chasing 65mm with the 765. Not a high performance set for s35mm frame sizes. Nice set for large format, but there are a few other options.

for me the Master Primes, while excellent, miss one of the reasons that you would use a prime - when size and weight are important. Cameras keep getting smaller....

I've done some informal testing with a few of the Leica's and they were really good. I'm sure the retail service centers and the ones that will support the cine lenses will be different with different attitudes.

In Lenvy we trust.

Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com
Click to expand...

Thanks for the insight Matthew. Exciting times in this industry and I'm sure
we'll see a lot of cool happenings when it comes to lenses.

What's your opinion on the Cooke 5's? I know they are large as well, maybe
not as big as the MP's ... but curious about your opinion. They cover the
S35 format, but not sure if their wide lenses will fully cover the Epic.

There are a couple places that carry them now in LA -- I may rent them for
a short project and see how I like them.

Thanks,

Anthony

P.S. -- I agree with you ... whatever Leica's support issues in the past, it's
hard to imagine them or BandPro not fully taking care of a customer who
drops nearly $200,000 on a set of lenses.
 
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