Chris Nolan and "Inception"

[Craig W. Bickerstaff]

really Chris? I think you do. because as Terance Malick would say (do you even know who he is?) "this was one for uncle" - and again

CHRIS NOLAN himself called it an "Action/Heist film"] 2:05 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B3AlNARaZM
he goes into detail about Leo's character... sorry dude, this movie was clearly "dumbed down for the masses" and I like call it (with the one exception of Hans Zimmer score)

INCEPTION: "An intellectual film for Dummies"

That post is kind of offensive quite frankly, You didn't like the movie I get that I respect that but don't say that the movie is for stupid people because you didn't feel that it had a deep enough plot.

 

[Sam Eilertsen]

I really enjoyed Inception.

I think of it in the same vein as The Matrix. It's an extremely good action movie. It has an interesting and well-imagined plot, and maybe philosophical underpinnings, but it's still just an action movie and that's how it should be appreciated.

 

[PaulClements]

I really enjoyed Inception. I'm surprised anyone has issues with characterisation given the usual drivel in blockbusters these days. It's great to see people in the film industry using their imagination and not relying on CGI to sell a movie.

Interesting bit of info I just remembered. I was chatting to a grip who was working on a film with Cristopher Nolan starring Leonardo DiCaprio. Whether it was a working title or the originally intended title it was called 'The Descent'. We both thought it was a bit odd to have named it this given the 2005 British Horror film of the same name had a sequel coming out last year imaginatively titled 'The Descent: Part 2'.

However having seen the movie I can certainly understand why they wanted to call it 'The Descent', would've been a much better name in hindsight had it not been used so recently.

Paul

 

[Erich Ocean]

I wasn't upset when I saw it - I had a good time. I had fun. And that's it. It's just an action/heist movie. It made sense to me, and I didn't really feel like there was anything else to take in. It's firmly in the category of Oceans 11 and True Lies. Fun movies - not deep movies.

FWIW That was my take as well. And I think I liked Ocean's 11 and True Lies more (at least for repeated viewings -- but that's typical of comedy).

On another note: Nolan can't/doesn't/won't write/direct females well. Not sure what the deal is with that, but it's happened on enough films, with enough actresses that I think we have to put the blame squarely on Nolan.

Ellen Page's character hit a single note (poorly), and although Marion Cotillard had a decent performance, the role lacked depth. (We mainly feel for her character thanks to the secondary effects from Leo's performance, so it's hard for me to give any props to Nolan for that.)

Oh well, at least Nolan writes/directs men well.

 

[Thor Melsted]

Well, this was a fun thread until it turned into a circle-jerk of condescension.
I really don't understand why some people feel the need to suggest others are dumb for having a taste that doesn't match their own.

I think it takes a certain kind of genius to write a complex script that is still simple enough for most people to understand. That doesn't mean it's dumbed down. It means the writer/director can convey a complex scenario in a way most people understand - and that takes skill.
Having only 4 other people on earth being able to follow your plot doesn't mean you're an artist, it just means you're a lousy storyteller - and as it wouldn't make buck fifty, who's gonna pay for your next project?
Being able to reach a wide audience shouldn't be held against Nolan. On the contrary, he should be applauded for bringing smarter movies to the masses.
Think about it this way: Which would you rather see, more movies like this or another GI Joe?

 

[Meryem Ersoz]

They deserved to be mocked and ridiculed.

ha, ha...and beaten and starved as well.

I don't think this is a circle jerk of condescension - this is just a board where people are passionate about films and about their own opinions about films. it's what we do.

 

[Kim Frank]

On another note: Nolan can't/doesn't/won't write/direct females well. Not sure what the deal is with that, but it's happened on enough films, with enough actresses that I think we have to put the blame squarely on Nolan.

Ellen Page's character hit a single note (poorly), and although Marion Cotillard had a decent performance, the role lacked depth. (We mainly feel for her character thanks to the secondary effects from Leo's performance, so it's hard for me to give any props to Nolan for that.)

Oh well, at least Nolan writes/directs men well.

I completly agree with you. That's exactly what I meant. And that's strange, I heard he works very close with his wife on set (don't know if that's true) and women normally have a good eye for other women. Also he somehow seems to dislike blonde women.
Moss, Holmes, Gillenhall, Hall, Swank, Page, Cottilard... Only one Johannson.
It's strange that he in this case isn't taking the Lesson Hitchkock told.
Also IMO it wasn't just Cautillard that I couldn't relate to emotionally, for me it's impossible in any of his movies with the female charakters.

 

[chrislancaster]

really Chris? I think you do. because as Terance Malick would say (do you even know who he is?) "this was one for uncle" - and again

CHRIS NOLAN himself called it an "Action/Heist film"] 2:05 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B3AlNARaZM
he goes into detail about Leo's character... sorry dude, this movie was clearly "dumbed down for the masses" and I like call it (with the one exception of Hans Zimmer score)

INCEPTION: "An intellectual film for Dummies"

because as Michael Bay would say (do you even know who he is?) "Ker Pow Boom Bang Ka Bloooeeeyyy!!"

 

[Vladimir Cassel]

really Chris? I think you do. because as Terance Malick would say (do you even know who he is?) "this was one for uncle" - and again

CHRIS NOLAN himself called it an "Action/Heist film"] 2:05 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B3AlNARaZM
he goes into detail about Leo's character... sorry dude, this movie was clearly "dumbed down for the masses" and I like call it (with the one exception of Hans Zimmer score)

INCEPTION: "An intellectual film for Dummies"

Donal Wells (know who he is?)

 

[Thor Melsted]

I don't think this is a circle jerk of condescension - this is just a board where people are passionate about films and about their own opinions about films. it's what we do.

No I get that. But that wasn't my point. Being passionate about something is one thing, but calling people dumb for not feeling the same way is something else entirely - and is completely unnecessary.

 

[Bruce Allen]

I think people are taking Inception out of perspective. We all have our preferences and such, but we have to think of Inception as a popcorn blockbuster. There's no point considering it as "great art" and such. For what it is, Inception is a great film. I would even say there is a new "Plugging In" genre forming. It started with eXistenZ, which I still feel is the best film, popularized by The Matrix, then, several films like The Cell, Paprika, moving on to big blockbusters - Avatar and Inception. Clearly, they are inspired by the internet and our digital beings.

Goes way further back than that - Tron, for example. That animation scene from Mary Poppins, the holodeck in Star Treck, Pleasantville and Being John Malkovich etc...

I'm happy this has become a genre because I have a cracking script I wrote back in 2002 which is a sort of dark comedy send-up of all of these films.

A few years back, the creator of Grey's Anatomy read it and she was like "this is amazing, it's going to cost $60 million to do though and will require a studio with real guts because it's such a commercially risky thing to do".

So yeah, hopefully this will be a "bankable genre" in a half-decade's time when I get everything into place to get the film made

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[Subhadip Sen]

Goes way further back than that - Tron, for example. That animation scene from Mary Poppins, the holodeck in Star Treck, Pleasantville and Being John Malkovich etc...

I'm happy this has become a genre because I have a cracking script I wrote back in 2002 which is a sort of dark comedy send-up of all of these films.

A few years back, the creator of Grey's Anatomy read it and she was like "this is amazing, it's going to cost $60 million to do though and will require a studio with real guts because it's such a commercially risky thing to do".

So yeah, hopefully this will be a "bankable genre" in a half-decade's time when I get everything into place to get the film made

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

Ah, yes, I think we can attribute it to Tron. While we have "entering a different reality" in films all throughout history, the internet influence only hits in eXistenZ, I feel.

Good luck with your project, and yes, I do feel this subgenre has potential, especially as many people tend to spend half their lives on the computer these days.

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

Guys, its just some good nature ribbing for being told that if I dont think Inception is awesome. then I "just dont get it" - thats more offensive then what i wrote.

Do any of you remember the critic who likened Predator to a subversive commentary and analogy to deer hunting? Wherein men use camouflage and superior weaponry and firepower to hunt a defenseless animal? And how he thought it was brilliant to turn the tables on mankind? No way that was the intent of the filmmakers, yet someone read genius into the story.

The point is anyone can make an intelligent argument out of nothing... doesnt make it so.

For the last time, NOLAN's own words on the red carpet were "action/heist movie, blockbuster elements, visuals, etc... " almost like he was making excuses for it. People want to hail it as genius, so be it. Doesnt make me smart because I found it very predictable, and overtly cliche'd either... (again if he was subversively mocking Hollywood films, then its the greatest film... ever) But I dont think he was. I think he was making a fun action film set in the world of dreams which gives one excuses to break all kinds of rules and pretty much get away from logic and do killer stunts and VF and blow shit up in cool new ways. thats about it.

But my response was a direct retaliation to Lancasters comments... that any of us who didn't hail it as a masterpiece should be "mocked and ridiculed" ... hence me calling it an Intellectual Film for Dummies... get over it. its just friendly banter...

 

[Tom Lowe]

Do any of you remember the critic who likened Predator to a subversive commentary and analogy to deer hunting? Wherein men use camouflage and superior weaponry and firepower to hunt a defenseless animal? And how he thought it was brilliant to turn the tables on mankind? No way that was the intent of the filmmakers, yet someone read genius into the story.

Um, I mean I think that's actually what the filmmakers set out to do. It's pretty much about humans being hunted by a superior creature with superior technology. :confused1:

 

[James T Mather]

Do any of you remember the critic who likened Predator to a subversive commentary and analogy to deer hunting? Wherein men use camouflage and superior weaponry and firepower to hunt a defenseless animal? And how he thought it was brilliant to turn the tables on mankind? No way that was the intent of the filmmakers, yet someone read genius into the story.

I'd have to disagree with the last statement - It would seem to me that this is precisely what McTiernan and Co. had in mind when making it. It's a very up-front idea in the Thomas brothers script - not a "buried" notion like Orwell's Animal Farm which can be read by the uninitiated as a farmyard tale rather than a critical dissection of the Russian revolution.

EDIT - corrected for distractedness. Apols to all who took 1984 to be a breakdown of the Lenin/Trotsky revolution - everyone knows 1984 is about Simon Cowell.

 

[Cail Young]

not a "buried" notion like Orwell's 1984 which can be read by the uninitiated as a farmyard tale rather than a critical dissection of the Russian revolution.

I think you mean Animal Farm... 1984 is pretty overt.

 

[chrislancaster]

But my response was a direct retaliation to Lancasters comments... that any of us who didn't hail it as a masterpiece should be "mocked and ridiculed" ... hence me calling it an Intellectual Film for Dummies... get over it. its just friendly banter...

sar·casm
Pronunciation: \ˈsär-ˌka-zəm\
Function: noun
Etymology: French or Late Latin; French sarcasme, from Late Latin sarcasmos, from Greek sarkasmos, from sarkazein to tear flesh, bite the lips in rage, sneer, from sark-, sarx flesh; probably akin to Avestan thwarəs- to cut
Date: 1550
1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain
2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual b : the use or language of sarcasm
synonyms see wit

Do any of you remember the critic who likened Predator to a subversive commentary and analogy to deer hunting? Wherein men use camouflage and superior weaponry and firepower to hunt a defenseless animal? And how he thought it was brilliant to turn the tables on mankind? No way that was the intent of the filmmakers, yet someone read genius into the story.

The point is anyone can make an intelligent argument out of nothing... doesnt make it so.

IRONY
i·ro·ny1    [ahy-ruh-nee, ahy-er-] Show IPA
–noun, plural -nies.
1.
the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning



:ciappa:

I added definitions just in case you don't get it.

 

[Tim Whitcomb]

sar·casm
Pronunciation: \ˈsär-ˌka-zəm\
Function: noun
Etymology: French or Late Latin; French sarcasme, from Late Latin sarcasmos, from Greek sarkasmos, from sarkazein to tear flesh, bite the lips in rage, sneer, from sark-, sarx flesh; probably akin to Avestan thwarəs- to cut
Date: 1550
1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain
2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual b : the use or language of sarcasm
synonyms see wit

Do any of you remember the critic who likened Predator to a subversive commentary and analogy to deer hunting? Wherein men use camouflage and superior weaponry and firepower to hunt a defenseless animal? And how he thought it was brilliant to turn the tables on mankind? No way that was the intent of the filmmakers, yet someone read genius into the story.

The point is anyone can make an intelligent argument out of nothing... doesnt make it so. [/QUOTE=Tim Whitcomb]

i·ro·ny1    [ahy-ruh-nee, ahy-er-] Show IPA
–noun, plural -nies.
1.
the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning



:ciappa:

I added definitions just in case you don't get it.

and after posting the definition you still think its ok?(your posted definition specifies sarcasm as personal insult or attack)

we are trying to discuss a film here, not wage war on people who have an opinion contrary to your own... but at least now I know why you hailed that film a masterpiece.

 

[James T Mather]

I think you mean Animal Farm... 1984 is pretty overt.

oop sorry jumped rails mid sentence - one firefox window good, ten firefox windows baad!

Correct - my bad - retroactively amended. thanks.

 

[chrislancaster]

I never said masterpiece

there is only one movie that deserves that title