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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

CAMERA as GOOD as the SCARLET ??

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I saved up for a scarlet and held on to the cash for about a year. I needed something asap and I took a look around at EVERYTHING available, including DSLR. I ended up buying a Viper camera and I've never regretted it. In my opinion, at the time, I didn't see a better option in my budget. My next best option would have been a RED One, at considerably more money.
 
Aaron Newsome said:
I saved up for a scarlet and held on to the cash for about a year. I needed something asap and I took a look around at EVERYTHING available, including DSLR. I ended up buying a Viper camera and I've never regretted it. In my opinion, at the time, I didn't see a better option in my budget. My next best option would have been a RED One, at considerably more money.
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Which aspect ratio sensor did you get? And if you can, how much did you pay?

UPDATE: I see that it supports both in the same camera. Cool.
 
Erich Ocean said:
Which aspect ratio sensor did you get? And if you can, how much did you pay?

UPDATE: I see that it supports both in the same camera. Cool.
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Yes that is correct. 2.35:1 and 16x9 on the same sensor. They call it DPM (dynamic pixel management). I paid $15k for the body, which is about what they go for on ebay.
 
Aaron Newsome said:
Yes that is correct. 2.35:1 and 16x9 on the same sensor. They call it DPM (dynamic pixel management). I paid $15k for the body, which is about what they go for on ebay.
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Boy, I must be missing something here. A "Viper" is WAAAAAY more expensive than a RED-One, and would never sell on eBay, and you'd be even lucky to find one for sale at all. We're talking over $100,000.oo here fellas.

A Thomson Viper is a beautiful camera, but hardly affordable, unless you're a millionaire, of course.
 
George D. said:
Boy, I must be missing something here. A "Viper" is WAAAAAY more expensive than a RED-One, and would never sell on eBay, and you'd be even lucky to find one for sale at all. We're talking over $100,000.oo here fellas.

A Thomson Viper is a beautiful camera, but hardly affordable, unless you're a millionaire, of course.
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No they go for about 15k on ebay, I've seen a few in the last few months.
 
A Viper is not over $100K. Yes, they do sell on eBay. I was about to buy a Viper about 3 years ago and then held off to buy a RED One. I have seen used ones sell in the $15K range as well, both through typical market channels and on eBay. The demand for the Viper has mostly dried up these days, but those who have them are still using them where they can.

As for the Ikonoskop A-Cam thing... I have to agree with Justin. I have yet to see anything from that camera that doesn't look like crap. A real shame, too... I was hoping it would turn out to be a nice camera.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
A Viper is not over $100K. Yes, they do sell on eBay. I was about to buy a Viper about 3 years ago and then held off to buy a RED One. I have seen used ones sell in the $15K range as well, both through typical market channels and on eBay. The demand for the Viper has mostly dried up these days, but those who have them are still using them where they can.

As for the Ikonoskop A-Cam thing... I have to agree with Justin. I have yet to see anything from that camera that doesn't look like crap. A real shame, too... I was hoping it would turn out to be a nice camera.
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Well, OK, then I guess I stand corrected. When I was researching them I sure couldn't find anything in regards to selling for a price like that. And, the only things I came across were for brand new cameras, and they were friggin' expensive. In fact, I had a very hard time finding any real worthwhile data on them at all.

Why has the demand for that camera, especially if it's supposed to be so good, "dried up" ??

So far, I have not heard a single thing "good" about the Ikonskop A-Cam.
 
George, there's a lot of reasons no one uses Viper. None of them have anything to do with quality of results. This is one fine camera and the results are proven, with many, many feature films, advertisements, television shows, etc.

The biggest reason no one uses it, is because they don't make them anymore. Even when they did make them, they were very expensive and there was no marketing machine hyping them up on forums or putting out 3D renders to make filmmakers want one. You either knew what it was and wanted to use it, or you didn't.

The viper is not a camera system. It's not a camcorder. It's a camera head. It doesn't have a built in recorder, it doesn't do audio or any of the other things an integrated camera system does. It's a camera head with SDI outputs. Imagine even when they were making them, there was no easy way to record a 4:4:4 uncompressed in a portable way. The options for a portable or even semi portable recorder clocked in at about $50k, that's in addition to the cost of the camera head.

Hell, even today, you'd be hard pressed to find many portable, workable 4:4:4 recording solutions for under $50k. It's pretty clear that a camera+recorder is going to be more popular with shooters.

The B4 lenses are crazy expensive. Zeiss Digiprimes are ridiculously expensive. The cheapest HD lens that I know of is about $8k. That's a huge gap from low end PL mount or 35mm still lenses. You can get a decent SLR lens for around $1,000. A good $1k B4 mount lens does not exist.

And yes, of course you can find Vipers used for $15k. I just said earlier, I bought one. I've seen a few for sale in the $15-$25k range, so they are out there. They are not more expensive than a RED ONE. You'd have to spend a good $40k before you got a RED ONE ready to go to work. I spent considerably less than that with a camera rig that's built of truly modular parts.
 
Aaron Newsome said:
I spent considerably less than that with a camera rig that's built of truly modular parts.
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What are you using for recording? A Viper @ $15K doesn't sound half bad to me, and I rent glass on film projects anyway.
 
Erich Ocean said:
What are you using for recording? A Viper @ $15K doesn't sound half bad to me, and I rent glass on film projects anyway.
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I've got two. XDR and Cinedeck. Putting together a 3rd recorder now, uncompressed 4:4:4 and portable recording to a 4x SSD raid.
 
Yes. It record progressive (only): 30PsF (NTSC) and 25PsF (PAL).

It output the uncompressed 1080p feed on the HDMI port, which you can record to ProRes with an AJA Ki Pro. There are also lens adaptors for PL and Nikon G in the works at around $500 USD each.
 
Mohammed El Sharqawy said:
i meant it records interlaced only.. 60i this is what is written on their website..
can you please write down a link for the lens adapters?
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30PsF is progressive 30p in a 60i container. That's why it says 60i. The camera CANNOT record interlaced footage, it can only put progressive footage in an interlaced container (aka PsF).

http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/freshdv/story/sony_nex-vg10_announced/

http://www.lensadaptor.com/2010/07/17/sony-e-mount-lens-adaptors-coming-soon/
 
Ryan Sims said:
There is no great way to make 24p footage from a 30 PsF format.
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+1

If you want to use the NEX-VG10 for feature films, you'll need to purchase the PAL model. 25PsF is completely workable for a low budget filmmaker.
 
Sony is testing the waters with the VG10. If well received, they will undoubtedly make a pro model that does 24fps. Just as they have done with other consumer cameras in the past that later ended up with "pro" versions that cost a bit more -- FX1 to Z1, for example. Based on the initial reception of the NEX series compact cameras with E-Mount, I think Sony is on the right track. As I posted above, I just got my hands on the NEX-5. Other than some shortcomings with the menus, and a few features not implemented yet in the firmware, the camera is frickin' awesome for a compact SLR type camera. I bought it for a compact stills camera that can accept a variety of lens options. The fact it shoots crappy, aliased video is a bonus for home movies or whatnot.

Lens adapters are coming. Leica M mounts are plentiful already. I have a Sony E-Mount to Nikon adapter (G type with aperture control) showing up on tuesday or wednesday, as these are already being sold on eBay. There's vendors selling Canon adapters too, but I'll start with the Nikon mount as I have more old manual primes in Nikon. The mounts from Lensadaptor.com look promising... I want a PL mount. The NEX should make a nifty little location scouting camera / directors finder type camera, especially if I can put my PL glass on it.

As for the VG10, it looks very promising for its intended market. I don't know if I'd buy one when I should have Epic cameras soon. But it's not a cinema camera by any means, even though it can be adapted to a variety of lenses. If they make a pro version that does 24fps, I'll take a look... Then again, the price may just be a steal with an estimated $1800 street price and that includes the 18-200 electronic e-mount zoom.
 
yI took a good look at NEX-5 yesterday, took some footage and brought home, then started to see it on the monitors. It's the same as EOS, the footage look great on the built in small monitor, but as soon as you display them on the decent full HD monitor, you would start to see the moire and more judders than should be.

I almost bought it yesterday, thinking it would be high quality camera for web only, but stopped me because it doesn't do 24p. Then I though for web, 30p is okay but when I evaluated the footage, I totally gave up.

It's probably the greatest small single lense digital camera with full-hd video feature, but I'm going to see what Panasonic will do the next. Of course I'm talking about these being my pocket camera, my main camera would be fixed lens Scarlet.
 
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