There is no need to be mean :(

[Bill Anderson]

I believe there are many people out there who deserve to have a RED camera, and, for one reason or another, can't afford one (I don't include myself in this category). It is extremely naive to believe that one's financial position is a reflection of one's ability. I could cite many examples of rags to riches, and the reverse scenario, I could name quite a few artist living in near penury whose talents far exceed other artists living in luxury. Not to mention the great auteur who made less money than Arnold's pool guy. I would expect Jim Jannard to understand this as well as anyone. It is a chaotic world, it does not fit into simple and common categorizing. If I were in a position similar to Jim's, the first thing (and most likely the only thing) I would ask myself is "what unique talent, what compelling reason has this guy shown that would qualify him to receive a free camera?" And the answer I would come up with is "absolutely none". However, we digress, I would not donate a RED cent to this guy's scheme because it would deny many others who show a great deal more potential.

 

[Andy Jarosz]

I believe there are many people out there who deserve to have a RED camera, and, for one reason or another, can't afford one (I don't include myself in this category). It is extremely naive to believe that one's financial position is a reflection of one's ability. I could cite many examples of rags to riches, and the reverse scenario, I could name quite a few artist living in near penury whose talents far exceed other artists living in luxury. Not to mention the great auteur who made less money than Arnold's pool guy. I would expect Jim Jannard to understand this as well as anyone. It is a chaotic world, it does not fit into simple and common categorizing. If I were in a position similar to Jim's, the first thing (and most likely the only thing) I would ask myself is "what unique talent, what compelling reason has this guy shown that would qualify him to receive a free camera?" And the answer I would come up with is "absolutely none". However, we digress, I would not donate a RED cent to this guy's scheme because it would deny many others who show a great deal more potential.

Solution:

Contests.

 

[Erik Franzén]

Heh, heh....I do have kids - you don't understand that getting aggressive and getting irritated works wonders under the right circumstance's.

Ah, yes. I can see that. Maybe I should've used some more appropriate term. How about "violent" and "physical"? I know that getting annoyed or yelling out to clear the air can work wonders, but at the point of physical violence is where the line is drawn. I am NOT implying you didn't understand that, just clearing up that I do understand that getting irritated or angry is fully justified; what I meant to say was that getting violent or too aggressive is very, very very destructive.

Oh well, back on topic! I think the guy was begging too much and trying too little. I can think of a dozen causes I would have given that kind of money too; his is not one of them. The part that made it so irritating to me was that he didn't say what he was going to do with it except for a very general "shoot my next feature" kind of deal.

OK, listen, it's great you want a RED One and all. I want one too. But don't come begging for one if you don't even have a specific need lined up. Take an example: If SIMILO had come here asking for the kind of money and earnestly told me and the community at large that they wanted to use to buy a RED One and produce some parts of their movie or what have you no one would have complained. Why?
Well, simple. Because it has a need. You didn't. All I saw was a dude wanting a RED without any valid reasons beyond how awesome it is. Sorry, but that's not a selling point.

Be harsh and honest and think about it; if I had put up exactly the same effort and you've come across my ad - would you have donated? I think we all know the answer is 'no'.
Put away this effort and go ahead and shot something. Like a trailer for your movie or what have you. And then ask for financing for that. If you find you need a RED then, well, go ahead and ask for that too! But your project be better damn godlike if you want people to fork out large cash when they have no reason to trust a stranger. Crowdfunding isn't easy. You said so. Yet you seem to have taken the easy route.

That, and no other reason, is why you got hostile responses. Because nothing comes easy, and if that is how you get around, then you will only be around long enough to notice that that's not how it works.
:rant:

 

[Liam Hall]

I read that thread. You're stepping on thin ice over here.

Your post is enough to be sued in the civilized world. I would think twice before posting next time.

Nonsense.

 

[Graham_C]

Solution:

Contests.

How about an annual "Red scholarship".Something pretty serious,that didn`t just offer a Camera and off you go,but a thorough multidisciplined internship to go with it..A real working apprenticeship of sorts in this industry,think Reducation, but for a year.I think it would be fantastic.

 

[Andrew Rieger]

Lets get real here. First things first. If you don't like his method of requesting funding, don't donate. I certainly would not donate, but I would also not go out of my way to be mean to the guy. If you would not say it to his face, don't say it on the internet. If you would say those things to his face, you may need counseling.

Granted, he did not go about requesting funding in the right way. He would have been much more successful if he had a film in mind and wanted to rent. Is he a scam? No, he posted his shot films and if you bothered to look, he did have references, a production site and an IMDB page. Unless he was not who he says he was, he was just a guy looking for a way to fund a camera. Many people fund films through these crowdfunding sites. I was really shocked out how nasty some people were in that thread. Please try to be more civil next time.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Heh, heh....I do have kids - you don't understand that getting aggressive and getting irritated works wonders under the right circumstance's.

Having two kids myself, I completely agree. But it should also be noted that the same behavior can totally backfire on you when used under the wrong circumstances.

As for that other thread, it was closed because of where the discussion was headed. This thread isn't doing a whole lot better. And the guy begging for money to buy RED is pathetic, but that's about it. No scam there. And not cool of him to post one of RED's reels that showcases the work of others. This guy has an IMDB page with credits, he could be showing projects he has actually taken part in, but he chooses not to... Why is that? Whatever... I'm not sure why anyone would give him a penny, but it seems that some people have.

 

[Graham_C]

`E-rage` sadly seems quite common these days.

 

[Michael Schrengohst]

Having two kids myself, I completely agree. But it should also be noted that the same behavior can totally backfire on you when used under the wrong circumstances.

I absoutely agree. Raising children can be a tightwire rope walking act.
So when a dude puts up a site begging for money it just really wrankles me
that he really does not understand much about anything. He needs to buy a cheap HD camera and go out and make some videos. Cut your teeth for about 10 years, save your money and then buy the RED. But I am afraid his attitude of entitlement is why America is going in the crapper. :banghead:

 

[Robert Frank]

`E-rage` sadly seems quite common these days.

As are internet scams. E-begging too.

 

[Robert Frank]

Lets get real here. First things first. If you don't like his method of requesting funding, don't donate. I certainly would not donate, but I would also not go out of my way to be mean to the guy. If you would not say it to his face, don't say it on the internet. If you would say those things to his face, you may need counseling.

Getting real.

I'm not donating.

I wasn't going out of my way to be mean. He put himself in the position of asking for money and having his request scrutinized.

I would say it all again to his face. I expressed my opinion, just as he acknowledged. He opened himself up to criticism, just as I did. I made no personal attack. I don't need counseling. I did however question his motives.

My last comment on this: I have seen many people who are in actual need. From senior citizens who can't keep up with basic living expenses, victims of domestic abuse, those affected by natural disaster, etc. Some more ordinary examples of people in need are the local youth group that I gave my old DV camera to, helping a friend recover from severe economic loss by giving him a place to stay, etc. I hope you see where I'm going with this.

I find it offensive to see someone who has a job and the capability to pay for equipment, asking for the world to buy it for him. I asked if he has ever done any real community service.

It seemed like it was all about getting and not giving. That's as real as it gets.

 

[Mark B.]

I didn't read the thread, but the idea of asking for money and gear seems logical enough. I've been begging around to get props for a movie I want to make. I'll probably have to beg for money to afford production insurance and wardrobe/food/etc. I've often thought about begging Jim for a free upgrade to the Epic camera. Begging just seems to be in style these days, what with the current economy totally sucking and jobs being scarce.

I like Andy's suggestion of the contests. Red could have a "potential skills" contest every quarter. The person who turns in the best short-film (shot on a cheapo non-Red camera) would win a free Red camera. Decision of the winner would be by popular vote from the attending Red employees.

Also, Red should put together a shorts contest just for Red owners. The top prizes would be Red accessories. Just something to make life a little more fun for the poor huddled Red owners.

 

[Sterling Wescott]

I like Andy's suggestion of the contests. Red could have a "potential skills" contest every quarter. The person who turns in the best short-film (shot on a cheapo non-Red camera) would win a free Red camera. Decision of the winner would be by popular vote from the attending Red employees.

That would be sweet!
That would bring attention to RED
That would be ultimately profitable for RED!
That would NEVER HAPPEN!
RED is incredibly revolutionary, but not that revolutionary. If this happens I will eat my hat.

(The hat thing is an incentive! If red does anything even remotely like this I will literally post a video of myself eating a hat. Piece by piece...
I'm kidding... Not really thought)

 

[Cristina S]

Nonsense.

I agree with Maria. I wouldn't write that. He would actually have a good chance to finally have his Red One for free. You cannot publicly call "scam artist" to someone only because he seems so to you.

 

[Joe D'Arcy]

I have just been informed that I have a recently deceased uncle in Nigeria who has left me an inheritance. If you would like to pm your bank details and relevant passwords, I will forward them on to my new relatives who will then give you all the money you need to buy a Red.

 

[Liam Hall]

You cannot publicly call "scam artist" to someone only because he seems so to you.

I don't say it lightly, I had a good look at his website, read his references and watched his "work". Take a look yourself. You don't need to be Sherlock Holmes to realize this guy is trying it on - the evidence is plain to see.

 

[Jean Iona]

Well, the guy just cancelled his campaign after so much negativity! I hope you are proud of yourselves!

 

[Bill Anderson]

Maybe Jim should produce a line of tin mugs with the RED logo on them. ( :

 

[Robert Frank]

Well, the guy just cancelled his campaign after so much negativity! I hope you are proud of yourselves!

Is this a trick question? Seriously. Maybe now we can move on.

I would rather see him put as much effort into earning the money to buy a RED as he did with his website, blog, fundraising etc.

 

[DCC Erickson]

Well, the guy just cancelled his campaign after so much negativity! I hope you are proud of yourselves!

If that's why he cancelled his campaign, he's crazy. One message board full of opinionated shooters doesn't actually make a difference in the world. If he had any imagination he'd figure out ways to bring in co-producers, partners, arts programs, etc... as opposed to walking around with his hand out. There are a million ways to get a movie made and you start with a great idea, not necessarily a RED camera. As for feelings being hurt by what some stranger says to you in a message board, oh come on!