Snap shot flash Look?

[Kim Frank]

For my next project I need to create a flash look.
The main inspiration are the Photographies from NAN GOLDINS book "the ballad of sexual dependency"





Mark Romanek once did a Video for FIONA APPLE "Criminal" shot by Harry Savides.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFqF65kwitM
Criminal Video






On ROMANEKS website is written that his main influence also was NAN GOLDINS book and that he and SAVIDES built a small lightsource to create the look of a flashlight using a store-bought $11.00 halogen bulb, that they placed on top of the camera.

Here APPLE, ROMANEK and SAVIDES talk about the clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bJHQmzrLm0
talking about

I'm wondering if anyone knows what fixture they exactly used or If you have an idea how you would create such a lightsource.

 

[Bill Anderson]

Also consider using a ring light ( like the ring light flash for stills): that is, a light that fits over (like a donut) and around the lens. It is as close to an on axis light as you can achieve, and it provides for a very nice phenomenon called the "limb effect". I'm not sure if there is such a beast for film, but there should be. The so called limb effect, at its best, shows the outlines and contours of faces and limbs and such, as the on axis light falls off to shadow much quicker and more dramatically than typical "frontal lighting"- strange as this may seem. Apart from past and present fashion shots, many great examples are to be found in the nudes of Edward Weston. Even his Famous Pepper images display a little of this, since he often placed the peppers inside an enclosure such as a bucket: hence the light emanated from one direction and, I imagine, apart from a little incident light bouncing off the sides of said bucket, provided for an on axis (with the lens) light.
Watch out for "red eye". No pun intended.

 

[Bill Anderson]

The harder and more focused the light, the greater the effect.

 

[Brad Webb]

Here is a whole thread about getting this look.

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=33791

 

[Bill Anderson]

Yep, that should do the trick.

 

[Kim Frank]

Also consider using a ring light ( like the ring light flash for stills): that is, a light that fits over (like a donut) and around the lens. It is as close to an on axis light as you can achieve, and it provides for a very nice phenomenon called the "limb effect". I'm not sure if there is such a beast for film, but there should be. The so called limb effect, at its best, shows the outlines and contours of faces and limbs and such, as the on axis light falls off to shadow much quicker and more dramatically than typical "frontal lighting"- strange as this may seem. Apart from past and present fashion shots, many great examples are to be found in the nudes of Edward Weston. Even his Famous Pepper images display a little of this, since he often placed the peppers inside an enclosure such as a bucket: hence the light emanated from one direction and, I imagine, apart from a little incident light bouncing off the sides of said bucket, provided for an on axis (with the lens) light.
Watch out for "red eye". No pun intended.

There is the Kino flo Kamio for example
http://www.kinoflo.com/12VDC Systems/Kamio/Kamio.htm
But I don't like the reflection of the Ring in the eyes when in axis
Though it can be a nice eyelight if mounted a bit out of axis because of it's soft characteristic and fast fall off
But a ringlight (even in still photographie) is a rather soft and large source compared to the tiny flash of a snapshot camera.

 

[Kim Frank]

Here is a whole thread about getting this look.

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=33791

I knew that thread, but it's about setting beauty light like with Briese Flashs.
These create a large soft lightsource, that you can control by focussing/moving the fixture insight the umbrella back and forth.
So its kind of the oppisite of what I'm searching for.
My goal is to create a light like the built in flash of a snapshot camera.
The light has to be tiny, but still very bright and throw a very direct shadow.
I think even the bulb of a 800 Ianibeam would still be too big.
Also it would need some kind of housing.
I would really love to know how SAVIDES accomplished this for the
award winning video.

 

[Bill Anderson]

Make your own to suit, Kim. It doesn't have to be "soft" or "large".

 

[Kim Frank]

Bill, that's exactly what I mean: I don't want a large soft light, but a very tiny, powerful hard light, like a in camera flash.

Maybe really using the insight of a readhead

with the halogen bulb (800W tungsten)

This would need a different housing and could stil be too large compared to the size of a on top of, or built in camera flash.

 

[jake blackstone]

Do not forget, that they shot the clip on film, with film having much greater latitude to overexposure. From what I can see, in places, they can barely bring the skin tones back from being completely blown out. No such luxury, with even MX Red. Make sure you're exposing correctly and dig into blacks in post.

 

[Justin Chin]

I'd experiment with a 650w or 300w on a boom or offset on a roller stand so you can easily position it over the camera. You would need to be prepared with a full set of scrims to suit variance of the shots as well. I'd also put it on a dimmer for some added flexibility using pre cut CC gels to even the temp out as needed.

 

[Paul Hazlett]

i think you guys are over thinking this. i would experiment with an LED flash light and a m-x red, the red in the eyes is another matter for post

 

[Kim Frank]

Do not forget, that they shot the clip on film, with film having much greater latitude to overexposure. From what I can see, in places, they can barely bring the skin tones back from being completely blown out. No such luxury, with even MX Red. Make sure you're exposing correctly and dig into blacks in post.

Thanks Jake, I agree completely

 

[Kim Frank]

I'd experiment with a 650w or 300w on a boom or offset on a roller stand so you can easily position it over the camera. You would need to be prepared with a full set of scrims to suit variance of the shots as well. I'd also put it on a dimmer for some added flexibility using pre cut CC gels to even the temp out as needed.

What do yo mean by 650w or 300w - a Par?
Sonds a bit like what they did in the very first LADY GAGA video "just dance"

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5pxey_lady-gaga-just-dance_music
clip

http://www.lady-gaga.de/videos/detail/video/90884/0/making-of-just-dance/
making of

But it looks really different to the FIONA APPLE CLIP. They're getting multiple shadows and the whole looks a lot softer.

I really think the goal is to create a light source as big as a flashunit.

 

[Kim Frank]

i think you guys are over thinking this. i would experiment with an LED flash light and a m-x red, the red in the eyes is another matter for post

I also thought about LED.
But I'd rather invest in an professional 5600 K balanced on camera light like the Swixtronic.
http://www.switronix.com/product_details2.php?cmd=info&id=209



But I would have to test, because what I know from the LITE PANEL LEDs are pretty soft from the start. Maybe a smaller fixture would focus the light more.