Dsmc..

[Luis de la Cerda]

Originally Posted by Jannard

I don't think skew, a consumer compression scheme and 30P only is nit-picking... unless you want to shoot home movies. Do you really believe that this camera is worthy of shooting episodics? Really? Have you ever been to a movie set?

RED is a professional camera system. And you are tying to make a Canon 5D MK whatever a professional motion capture system at any price? What exactly is your point?

Jim

I don't think the "consumer compression scheme" argument is a fair one against this camera. We've all seen the videos canon posted. It looks at least as good as or better than "professional codecs" such as DVCPROHD, XDcamHD, HDV, XDCamEX, etc... On one hand it has better chroma resolution (from the looks of it, at least 4:2:2), virtually no mosquito noise, apparently handles things inside YUV colorspace (which is nice) and very little macroblocking. I know there's higher quality alternatives out there, such as redcode, but the files canon has posted are far from what you're making them out to be from a compression standpoint. YUV H.264 at 35Mbps is nothing to sneeze at. Maybe I'm missing something here, but apart from HDcam, Cineform and RedCode, what else even compares to it?

PS. I'm sure we've all seen movies at the theatre shot on plain DV... This is a huge leap from that.

[Dave Cooper]

Originally Posted by Daniel Chrisander

Then it will be Sony's turn. They will come with 28MP and take most of our high end business.

Not unless they figure out how to control noise.

[Jannard]

Originally Posted by cholo

I don't think the "consumer compression scheme" argument is a fair one against this camera. We've all seen the videos canon posted. It looks at least as good as or better than "professional codecs" such as DVCPROHD, XDcamHD, HDV, XDCamEX, etc... On one hand it has better chroma resolution (from the looks of it, at least 4:2:2), virtually no mosquito noise, apparently handles things inside YUV colorspace (which is nice) and very little macroblocking. I know there's higher quality alternatives out there, such as redcode, but the files canon has posted are far from what you're making them out to be from a compression standpoint. YUV H.264 at 35Mbps is nothing to sneeze at. Maybe I'm missing something here, but apart from HDcam, Cineform and RedCode, what else even compares to it?

PS. I'm sure we've all seen movies at the theatre shot on plain DV... This is a huge leap from that.

Fair enough... I'll just have to stick with skew and 30P then. Sorry, my bad. Although I would rather color correct from RAW.

We have seen our footage on a 60' screen. I have only seen locked down Canon footage on my computer screen.

Jim

[Gunleik Groven]

soooooo funny...

[Alan Fletcher]

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/re...dmkiipre.shtml

As for the Canon 5D MKII – I see no jello-ish artifacts. I'm not saying that they may not be there, but in the day of shooting that I did, taking quite a few shots to specially look for it, I didn't see any.

[ Refers to Nikon, Sony EX-1 and RED ]

<EDIT> They're calling the beast a 'combocam' and have opened a new forum for them (some oldish RED references).
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...p?showforum=46

[Evin Grant]

Skew is neither here nor there. H264 and 30P are both deal breakers. The 5DmII is remarkable for what it portends not for what it can do.

[Tom Lowe]

Originally Posted by Evin Grant

Skew is neither here nor there. H264 and 30P are both deal breakers.

Why are those dealbreakers?

[Luis de la Cerda]

Originally Posted by Jannard

Fair enough... I'll just have to stick with skew and 30P then. Sorry, my bad. Although I would rather color correct from RAW.

We have seen our footage on a 60' screen. I have only seen locked down Canon footage on my computer screen.

Jim

Add to that variable frame rates, better control over shutter angle, balanced audio inputs, more flexible physical configurability (is that a word?), interchangeable lens mounts (at least on the red one), focus and exposure assist tools, more flexible monitoring, not to mention second to none customer support all the way to the very top of the company, just to name a few.

Don't sell yourself short ;)

[Evin Grant]

Originally Posted by Tom

Why are those dealbreakers?

H264 is a chroma sub-sampled (4:2:0 most likely) Long GOP codec incapable of real post manipulation or frame accurate (without transcoding) edits.

30P is a fine frame rate for web videos but without 24P no commercial, music video or narrative project will touch it. It can't be released theatrically and conversion to 24P will be messy at best. In this regard the Nikon D90, even with it's skew and Mjepg is a superior tool for indie filmmakers.

[Luis de la Cerda]

Originally Posted by Evin Grant

H264 is a chroma sub-sampled (4:2:0 most likely) Long GOP codec incapable of real post manipulation or frame accurate (without transcoding) edits.

30P is a fine frame rate for web videos but without 24P no commercial, music video or narrative project will touch it. It can't be released theatrically and conversion to 24P will be messy at best. In this regard the Nikon D90, even with it's skew and Mjepg is a superior tool for indie filmmakers.

The quicktime originals posted on dpreview look like 4:2:2 to me. I've dropped them into my timeline (newtek speededit) and so far they lend themselves to straight editing just fine. 30P is ok for commercial and music video work as long as the client likes how it looks. It's pretty straight forward to work with. Even when your final destination is 24P, most of the stuff I regularly do, such as car beauty shots and running footage can be worked with at 30P, either by slowing down to 24P or ramping up to 48P and getting rid of every second frame. YMMV