Real camera tests...

[Matt Ryan]

You know, this could go either way. Clearly Jim is very confident in his product ( and rightfully so) but this is a chance for the other companies to say " hey yeah red has better x or y, but we have better z" Quite honestly, I can see them not showing up being almost as bad as showing up. If they don't show up, we have the right to ask why they would be unwilling to compare their product on a fair stage. If they do they might come out with bragging rights in some aspect. Still, I doubt they will. its dangerous if they do, damning if they don't. Still I like the idea that red would be willing to concede defeat in an aspect if it needed too. Although I don't think that would last long.

RED has done in house chart tests before without bias. They did an Alexa vs. MX test way back and they provided the test and flat out said the Alexa had slightly more DR than MX, but with HDR MX blew it away (they provided grabs of the charts).... RED isn't afraid of the tests, they just want them done correctly and in a relevant honest test.

I think the ZACUTO test has failed on the fact they let each camera "pro" relight the scene...This alone discredits the 'test." If they wanted to do it right, they could have lit the set with a greater DR than any of the camera's can physically capture and see which ones actually capture the widest range of DR, maintain resolution in the harsh contrast, as well as color rendition... This is a scenario where RAW and LOG would prove invaluable...

[Evan Starkey]

I think your right if i was making a movie tho i would want to test for that specific content...watching other movies or tests would only give me a rough guide i think. The reason i like RED among other things is the diversity that raw allows.

[Bruce Allen]

I'm sorry but I'm confused. Why not just work with Zacuto in the first place?

Zacuto did offer the camera companies control over who shot and how the footage was processed.
(Although... if it's THAT difficult for RED footage to be processed in a standard environment, that shows there are problems, no?)

And I'm sure if RED wanted to help Zacuto to organize 4K post grading environments and 4K projectors for all of the venues, it'd be cool.

This seems just like an attempt to discredit a lot of other peoples' hard work after the fact.

Apart from just being nasty...what is the point of this test?

Why not just work with Zacuto next year?

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

[Richard_JP]

See, what you've done here Jim is appeared to have presented a fair test for everyone to join. But the fact is, you've given the other manufacturers just 1 month notice, therefore knowing that they probably wont be able to join. And now you'll snarl at the other manufacturers for not showing up, and the RED army will gloat about how the Epic would have kicked ass. Kinda childish. I'd say, to at least appear to be fair, give them a reasonable amount of notice, yeah?

[Josh Snyder]

I'm sorry but I'm confused. Why not just work with Zacuto in the first place?

Zacuto did offer the camera companies control over who shot and how the footage was processed.
(Although... if it's THAT difficult for RED footage to be processed in a standard environment, that shows there are problems, no?)

And I'm sure if RED wanted to help Zacuto to organize 4K post grading environments and 4K projectors for all of the venues, it'd be cool.

This seems just like an attempt to discredit a lot of other peoples' hard work after the fact.

Apart from just being nasty...what is the point of this test?

Why not just work with Zacuto next year?

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

Good post. I think this just hurts RED's reputation the same way that the Bloom incident did.

[Matthew Scott]

I think your right if i was making a movie tho i would want to test for that specific content...watching other movies or tests would only give me a rough guide i think. The reason i like RED among other things is the diversity that raw allows.

Yeah that makes sense :) And the RAW is such a massive plus in RED's favor....more valuable than resolution for me at this stage.

[C_Westover]

A month isn't enough time to respond? Huh?

[Matt Ryan]

See, what you've done here Jim is appeared to have presented a fair test for everyone to join. But the fact is, you've given the other manufacturers just 1 month notice, therefore knowing that they probably wont be able to join. And now you'll snarl at the other manufacturers for not showing up, and the RED army will gloat about how the Epic would have kicked ass. Kinda childish. I'd say, to at least appear to be fair, give them a reasonable amount of notice, yeah?

If it makes you feel any better the Sony shoot I Dp'd last week for their Make.Believe campaign called me 1 week before the shoot. So a month is plenty of time....

Also, that shoot hadn't even booked equipment yet... Jim has already taken care of that.

[Jason Sinclair]

All tests should be done in 4k for every manufacturer. Sorry this is just going to be standard cinema release from next year on. Any company which does not have one eye on the future is ripping their customers off at this stage in the game. I personally wouldn't involve myself with their drama.

[Richard_JP]

Well I can tell you that a month generally isn't long enough for huge companies to respond. For example, I know for a fact that the only working FS700 in Europe, was booked out months ago for another shoot during that week. So yeah, I would say that this is short notice.