Macpro doesn't have thunderbolt :(
|
|
02-06-2012, 09:26 AM
Macpro doesn't have thunderbolt :(
02-06-2012, 09:27 AM
Originally Posted by Barry Bishop
New one might. :)
David
02-06-2012, 09:28 AM
The Pocket Rocket?
02-06-2012, 09:35 AM
I like the idea but one of my concerns is the amount of separate modules that need to be connected
to a computer for offload and backup, eg... RED Station, Card Readers,
SSD Reader, Hard drives, LTO Backup drives etc...
IMO a Red Deck / Rocket would be the perfect tool and reduce the number of devices used
My Suggestion: Offer 2 Different Models of RED DECKS
1st A Basic RED DECK (Price Approx. 2.5 - 3K)
A stand-alone Red Deck with built in
1.8" and 2.5" SSD Drive bays and CF reader with an internal Raid hard dive, with all current
connections including 3G SDI with Audio, Dual Thunderbolt, HDMI, USB, Firewire 800 and
ethernet port.
With a built in (proxy) module for transcoding to different codecs and
wireless streaming to the internet.
The unit could connect to Desktops and Laptops and
export finished projects directly from the internal hard drive in
different codecs or stream directly to the web, as well as offering
Basic monitoring on film sets and other situations.
It would also act as a stand-alone player / ssd offload unit,
with built in export settings for different decks,
meaning it could be used with or without a computer.
2nd A RED DECK ROCKET (D-ROCKET) (aprox 5-6K)
A stand-alone Red Deck and Red Rocket with built in
1.8" and 2.5" SSD Drive bays and CF reader with an internal Raid hard dive, with all current
connections including 3G SDI with Audio, Dual Thunderbolt, HDMI, USB, Firewire 800 and
ethernet port.
With a built in (proxy) module for transcoding to different codecs and
wireless streaming to the internet.
Along with full 5K monitoring and output support.
The unit could connect to Desktops and Laptops and
export finished projects directly from the internal hard drive in different codecs
or stream directly to the web, as well as offering
Full 5K transcoding, and Monitoring / Output
It would also act as a stand-alone player / ssd offload unit,
with built in export settings for different decks,
meaning it could be used with or without a computer.
The RED DECK /ROCKET would also fit into current Broadcast and Post Workflows as well
as Film festivals or other situations and help with the Mass Adoption of Red Products and R3D.
My 2 Cents
02-06-2012, 10:32 AM
Hmmm....
While I kinda like the idea, and it's been discussed before, I think this is not a very forward-thinking approach or what people really want. They might think they want it, but in the end, we all want/need to be free from add-on hardware for transcoding or intermediate processing of R3D files.
That said, I would love to see a ThunderBolt version of the Rocket that is geared for transcode purposes, if it can be made soon and relatively cheap. Small footprint, even bus-powered, although that bus-powered thing is probably unlikely. I'm thinking something smaller than a RED Station module that has no connectors other than two ThunderBolt ports so it can connect and exist within a device chain. No video I/O, etc.. Just a wavelet/R3D processor, possibly coupled with a programmable hardware encoder that can handle ProRes, DNxHD and X.264...
Going back to my point above, I'm not sure if it's really what people ultimately want. No one is going to give a crap about getting footage converted to ProRes and DNxHD or whatever once they can seamlessly play and edit R3D files just as easily. I prefer RED continue focusing their efforts on the software tools and SDK. If they want to invest in more resources and people, then put them on those tasks. The latest crop of GPUs coming up in the near future have vastly improved compute engines and should be much better suited for wavelet decoding -- the computationally-expensive portion of R3D decode. I would rather see efforts concentrated there. IMO, if software can evolve to match current and upcoming (known) hardware, then such a Rocket product would (should) be obsolete within a year or two.
I'm also expecting to see new hardware and software tools that may obsolete the current Rocket when RedRay is finally released.
02-06-2012, 11:38 AM
Maybe David knows something we don´t...
Today my laptop i7 processed 5Ks to ProRes to an incredible speed, in a few months a E5 Dual Xeon platform will be even faster. A "as fast as Rocket" solution will be a super hit today.
If David find a kind of "Thunderbolt processor expander" ....or a magic wand.
02-06-2012, 12:36 PM
This is what I am thinking too Jeff. Something that is just there to chew through R3D data. A dedicated (offboard) solution is needed to chew through the processing needed to make R3D real time.
We are past watching render bars or seeing 4K footage play at 1/8 resolution.
The RedRocket is a great tool.
BUT
It costs almost half the price of a Scarlet. You can't have a revolution like that. You need to put both the inexpensive cameras AND the inexpensive post tools to go with it to form a complete system. Seeing your footage in high resolution in real time should come at a premium, but four years after the initial rocket, there has to be some tech out there that can create a lower priced, equal performance alternative.
Not giving all users slightly more affordable Realtime, will, IMHO eventually turn people off and move them to move toward what they percieve is an "easier" workflow. Note that I said perceive, because I do not think posting RED or posting ALEXA is any different or more complex.
David
02-06-2012, 12:38 PM
I know nothing.
I just think out loud here because maybe someone will listen or come up with a better solution.
RED has a kick ass camera. The goal would be to have an little box that really leverages the true power of RAW. Smal extremely powerful little boxes designed for every user and every post house that sees red material.
David
02-06-2012, 01:07 PM
Taking into account various types of productions and their requirements, as well as personal preferences, searching for a single optimal solution may go on for a long time. I see benefits in all solutions suggested 1) onboard Prores module, 2) Portable Rocket and 3) RedDeck which Ray suggested.
1) Onboard Prores module - DP wants the negative "developed" as seen on set, with minimal post-related variables, editing ready on any comp, sees 12 bit ProRes as "good enough"
2) Portable Rocket - makes any production .r3d RT ready with less fuss, portable and practical
3) RedDeck - Minimizes the need for additional .r3d playout & backup related computer hardware, additional parts, maintenance, cable clutter, modules etc...
Cam > deck = minimal variables and risk in handling the material, independent to camera body
As everything, none are perfect and all also have downsides, which are completely irrelevant for this point, as well as for the user whose priorities match devices advantages. I think all of those devices would find their customers.
If various professionals on Reduser working with the material daily suggest various potential solutions to their workflow, it does make sense that the same variety (at minimum) can be mapped onto a larger group as well.
I agree on the advantage of widespread seamless .r3d RT support, but that takes time.
02-06-2012, 02:23 PM
Great Post!
I think the DP, baked in look thing can be achieved with a look file generated in RCX Pro and loaded into the camera via an SSD card. I think post number one is a big compromise, but I think you might agree with me on that. :)
I think the key to your second point is to make RCXPro a fantasic I/O software. One-light and get into and out of the software for offline/online workflows.
R3D is a very friendly format for people who understand what they are doing. For noobs and people who are used to a "video" (as opposed to film) workflow, then a single box like this, even if it just handles the wavelet CODEC decompression and lets the computer and GPU pick up the slack, would go a lond way toward more RT workflows.
David
| « Previous Thread | Next Thread » |
