Thread: Phone camera depth measure for focus?

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  1. #1 Phone camera depth measure for focus? 
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Putting my Hydrogen on the Komodo using the Link I realized that the depth camera is properly facing the subject like the DJI lidar focus tracking does. Would it be possible to actually utilize this for autofocus? If there was a way to combine the internal AF of Komodo with using the depth capable cameras on Hydrogen or iPhone (especially with lidar) together with a face tracking addition to Red Control; wouldn't that mean we get a very powerful autofocus feature that far exceeds the standard one in Komodo?

    On top of that, if we could feed gyro data back from that phone into the R3D file, we could get a nearly perfect camera track for VFX.

    I think there are so many things that could be done with the Komodo Link and phone interface that we're now just scratching the surface of. I hope Mikael Lubtchansky and Red take a look at this because I think we have some untapped possibilities here beyond just controlling and viewing a video feed.
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  2. #2  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    I wouldn't rely on stereo optics in this case as Lidar is a better solution and far more accurate in a variety of situations when it comes to depth scanning. Shortly I think there will be one more advancement in this space, but I'm not sure until I test it.

    I'm not sure Komodo has a gryroscope or note, if it's in there it's not currently enabled, but agree that would be great.

    I suspect we'll see more things like the DJI micro-Lidar coming to market, but the key thing is to communicate to the camera or focus motor and also position it accordingly.

    AF will advance far this decade. So much happening in this space. I think every major generation of cameras from a few brands will see big leaps. Not to mention more miniaturization of Lidar and such.
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Holland View Post
    I wouldn't rely on stereo optics in this case as Lidar is a better solution and far more accurate in a variety of situations when it comes to depth scanning. Shortly I think there will be one more advancement in this space, but I'm not sure until I test it.

    I'm not sure Komodo has a gryroscope or note, if it's in there it's not currently enabled, but agree that would be great.

    I suspect we'll see more things like the DJI micro-Lidar coming to market, but the key thing is to communicate to the camera or focus motor and also position it accordingly.

    AF will advance far this decade. So much happening in this space. I think every major generation of cameras from a few brands will see big leaps. Not to mention more miniaturization of Lidar and such.
    Yeah, lidar is preferable. But don't the newer iPhones have Lidar built-in? What's powerful is that if we have a consistent video stream to the phone it could act as a processing unit for a lot of this stuff. If Komodo doesn't get face tracking, then it could be possible to have face-tracking on the phone. There's some delay, but mostly you want to have consistent placement of focus, which is more important than fast pulls.

    I don't think the gyro, if it exists, is of any use for a camera tracking application. It requires much more accuracy in timescale and position data that is per frame accurate. Phones can do this, otherwise, we wouldn't have as good AR as we do on iPhones. Combined with iPhone Lidar, if that data went back into the camera and R3D files, we would have really powerful metadata for VFX and stabilization directly "out of the box".

    As for AF systems, I still think that still lenses aren't very good. Cine lenses have a lot better quality so I'm still waiting for cine lenses with internal motors. I think that when we get Thalias and Signature primes lenses with internal motors for smooth focus pulls, it's gonna explode down towards cheaper brands as well. But for the moment, the DJI lidar focusing system is a really great way to get autofocus for lenses that cannot work this way. I mean, we can even put on old M42 vintage lenses and get autofocus for them, which is wild.
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  4. #4  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    You'll want different Lidar than what's available in phones is essentially what I'm saying. Mainly due to range and other limitations.

    Cameras can have frame accurate gyro data, but unsure where we are in really, really good gyro data and if it's in there for Komodo.

    Agree on some parts that AF in still lenses isn't very good. You'll see for newer mirrorless lenses both companies have revised their internal AF designs a bunch. In fact, when you see Canon's upcoming Cine-RF Zooms that will be much clearer. But yes, I do think much more robust motors are far more ideal for cinema glass in general.
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  5. #5  
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    This is the space I watch for a Lidar solution.
    https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/a...ofocus-adapter
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  6. #6  
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    Wonder what’s preventing DJI from pulling the Lidar/Motor off of the RS2 and selling it as a stand-alone unit for ~$250... I mean it’s as good as an Phase Detect AF (better?) and would work with every lens/camera.
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  7. #7  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike P. View Post
    Wonder what’s preventing DJI from pulling the Lidar/Motor off of the RS2 and selling it as a stand-alone unit for ~$250... I mean it’s as good as an Phase Detect AF (better?) and would work with every lens/camera.
    They only need some box that can attach the Raveneye, Lidar eye, power the focus motor and it would work. So far it works perfectly fine with tracking and stuff, but not at far distances due to how the lidar works. I would also like to be able to combine it with deliberate focus pulls, like program it to follow what's in focus so that you can pull focus from one person to another and let the lidar follow the new person in focus.

    I think the future of focus pulling will be a combination. Where the focus puller put the major focus planes in place and autofocus systems keep the focus locked at a subject.

    For DJI, I would like to be able to built a follow focus and RavenEye rig that is detachable from the RS2. So that you can have the camera be able to transmit video and have remote focus without being bound by only using it on the gimbal.
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