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  1. #3971  
    I just wanted to know if
    1: all pre-oders will be taken the same time but if you had bought a hydrogen you will get the discount
    2: or will there be a advance order for hydrogen
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  2. #3972  
    Senior Member Nick Morrison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karim D. Ghantous View Post
    The discussion for me has lots of nuances... but surface area matters more for film than it does for digital, as far as I know, and as far as I can tell. Monstro is superior to the Alexa 65 (and of course the LF) in pretty much every way I can think of, but it's smaller. That's because surface area matters less. Does anything exist that can beat Monstro?
    Monstro is amazing, but I don't know if many people will agree it's superior to Alexa 65 or even Alexa LF. The more important question is does it even matter?

    At this point most high end cameras are all so good we're splitting hairs.

    Any tribal belief that only one camera system is the best starts to reflect our politics, where we're all in isolated camps yelling at each other.

    The truth is - much like in politics - most cameras actually have way more in common than they are different. The difference btw LF, Monstro and Venice is probably 10%.

    And as for film - it has a unique look, and hopefully it sticks around as long as possible. It's another creative choice, and the more choices the better. Same goes for cameras and lenses. The more the better.
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  3. #3973  
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    Not sure if this has been stated yet, but will Komodo have ProRes or not??
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  4. #3974  
    Senior Member Bastien Tribalat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mestizo Devon View Post
    Not sure if this has been stated yet, but will Komodo have ProRes or not??
    Or not.
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  5. #3975  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bastien Tribalat View Post
    Or not.
    Can you point out, where it was sad about it? I thought the question is still open about it.
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  6. #3976  
    Senior Member Bastien Tribalat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Stolpakov View Post
    Can you point out, where it was sad about it? I thought the question is still open about it.
    "For now", it's still unknown because I dont' recall Jarred saying "no" but I think they would have mentionned it by now. And Soderbergh seems to use an external recorder with the camera to get ProRes anyway (to use as proxies I suppose) granted that the photo is pretty old by now and the feature may (or may NOT) have been added.


    So far, here is what's been said about
    Sensor Technology: New 6K Sensor that features global shutter and rolling shutter modes as well as Phase Detect Auto Focus
    Max Resolution: 61443240 (full sensor with DCI aspect ratio)
    Max Framerate: 6K FF @ 40fps, 6K WS @50fps, 4k @60fps shouldn’t be a problem, there should be 48fps modes available
    Anamorphic Support: Yes, but it will not be officially available till around two months after initial release
    Codec Support: Internal Compressed RAW (REDCODE RAW, R3D), unknown if other codecs are supported as of now
    Lens Mount: Integrated Canon RF Mount. Jarred said they are doing the EF protocol first, so native support for RF lenses will most likely not be there at launch.
    Media Type: CFast 2.0 (body features a media slot compartment w/ door). Jarred later said they are also testing CFexpress for future use, but for Komodo they decided to stick with CFast 2.0.
    Power Options: Dual slot Canon BP style batteries (various capacities) with hot swap and ability to run off one battery, DC input 12V (LEMO), Lower power draw than DSMC2
    Camera Control: Integrated Touch Screen, On Camera Buttons, Some sort of Smartphone Interface, WiFi Control, EXT Port
    Monitoring: Top Side Pogo Cableless Display Tech, 4K 6G or 12G SDI Out
    Audio: Mic In 3.5mm jack, Headphone Jack, Internal Scratch Mic
    Camera Cooling: It appears there’s an internal heat sink and fan w/ vent
    Form Factor: < 4x4x4″ with magnesium/aluminum alloy body
    Body Weight: < 2lbs
    Buttons/Indicators: on/off switch, power/status indicator, record button, tally light, menu, menu selection up/down, funtion set, playback (probably toggle), 2X eject buttons for batteries, media compartment open
    Wireless Camera Inteface/Control: WiFi w/ Antenna
    Mobile Phone Support: Android and iOS
    Rigging: 1/4″-20 around Pogo, 4X M4 around front of camera, 1X M3 for focus hook, general base plate form factor of DSMC2-style bodies
    VIDEO EDITING - COLOR GRADING - VFX
    APPLE FINAL CUT PRO, AVID MEDIA COMPOSER
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  7. #3977  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Marcus Rosen View Post
    Christoffer perhaps this is best saved for a conversation elsewhere... but until 1's and 0's can become the same physical process of exposing silver halide crystal to light, I cannot proceed with your discussion.
    Because the discussion of film vs digital is as old as the two of them, I think the best way to approach the question is to first distance oneself from the biases we have to any of it. Then examine the question from a broader perspective. If we do a deductive argument (philosophy), there's no denying the conclusion. Digital will someday be able to simulate and replicate the exact look of something. It might take a new form of sensor past CMOS technology, maybe some kind of nano-crystal layered sensor that bounce light in an organic form before registering or a sensor that doesn't use pixels in the same way we're used to, but my point was that we will reach a point where film and digital can't be distinguished at all. We cannot be more perceptive than human. Using today's measurements and biases for judging the future of digital needs to be more open-minded than "it can never be". There's no question that it will be, it's just something we have to embrace and I don't see the problem with that. Until that time, film will still be relevant. But whenever we're at the point when there's too few around to want that choice, no one will manufacture film anymore, so choice isn't really an option then.

    This is what I mean with the question being broader than just looking at digital vs film at this time in history. I could have made the argument back before Red and it would still hold true. In 20-30 years time, we might not even have cameras in the same way as we think of them today. The past 20 years have been a race to fine-tune digital still and video to match chemical film, but going forward it's more than that, it's about expanding the capabilities of the photographic language. 20 years from now we might not even have anything more than a box that we point in one direction and then everything can be fine-tuned in post. Speculating such technology requires more than just looking at sensor tech, it's world tech. It's closer to what futurist analytics do by combining different areas of tech and market to predict massive changes in society and tech. We might not even make movies 20 years from now in the same way anymore, maybe everything is done in realtime graphics, using cameras that don't photograph anything but capturing movement and facial expressions on actors not even used in physical form for the end result. While digital photography is more for family/life applications or for niche future hipsters using a new social media app that replicate the "old Instagram app back from the early 2000s".

    Technology like this evolves with society, with norms, economy and convenience. If the cost of making a Marvel-sized blockbuster in realtime graphics isn't more than an indie film, but still looks real and photographed, then no studio in the world would choose to actually film it for real. And if that applies to indie filmmakers as well, even the low budget ones benefit from it over shooting it for real. The niche of doing so would be so low in demand that no one but the super-rich would do it. There's no point in looking at what we individually like or dislike today, these things simply are and will be.

    For the next 10 years, I'll predict that at some point we get a new sensor tech that will take over CMOS. We will get a new battery tech that will drastically reduce sizes and increase shooting time. We will see the rise of Z Depth cameras opening the possibility to manipulate depth of field in post and putting in VFX elements without post tracking or rotoscoping. Makeup will start to lose its relevance on set since such things can be changed in post. Stabilizations will reduce in size and going into the 2030s we will probably no longer need rigs for it, all done in-camera. Noise will be much lower and shooting at up to ISO12800 will be noiseless without loss in image quality.

    Of course, all of those are speculations, but not wild speculations. There's too much that may happen going forward that the relevance of film will lose its grip faster than it's image quality loses relevance. So I'd say that film will die far before we even get to the point of exactly simulating the chemical process digitally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Marcus Rosen View Post
    The approach to crafting the image is entirely unique to the canvas you paint on, the painter, the brush...
    Would you like to paint on a canvas using tempera? I'll bet that there were wild discussions during the renaissance about how oil won't replace tempera and then it did. History won't care for our preferences and while tempera is possible to just use if you like, as some have done for the sake of it since the 16th century, no one will be able to just produce chemical film for their projects, not even for niche applications. I'd say that the death of film will happen when the simulation of the film process is indistinguishable from the real thing, not just the colors and grain, but every aspect of it. Even today, Steve Yedlin has done extensive work on trying to replicate everything that happens in a 35mm camera using digital cameras, and I'm talking about 10-20 years from now.

    Our preferences won't survive history.
    "Using any digital cinema camera today is like sending your 35mm rolls to a standard lab. -Using a Red is like owning a dark room."
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  8. #3978  
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    I have a thought. I know it’s not a good enough format for tv and film, but I think this camera could benefit from having an option to record to mp4 files.

    Reason being that this is a camera that will be used by a lot of on the go shooters. It will be placed along with dji Mavics, 360 cams, go pros ect... they all shoot mp4.

    MP4 is a very handy format for ‘quick’ edits say on a small laptop or as is becoming popular an iPad Pro. I know reds image is way to good to be compressed to mp4 but the option could come in very handy. I guess that’s what DSLRs are for thou.

    Anyway Just a thought.
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  9. #3979  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Stanley View Post
    I have a thought. I know it’s not a good enough format for tv and film, but I think this camera could benefit from having an option to record to mp4 files.

    Reason being that this is a camera that will be used by a lot of on the go shooters. It will be placed along with dji Mavics, 360 cams, go pros ect... they all shoot mp4.

    MP4 is a very handy format for ‘quick’ edits say on a small laptop or as is becoming popular an iPad Pro. I know reds image is way to good to be compressed to mp4 but the option could come in very handy. I guess that’s what DSLRs are for thou.

    Anyway Just a thought.
    You will likely be able to record MP4 via the smart phone interface just as you would on your phone or via an external recorder.
    But this is not a video camera. Redcode raw only internally.
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  10. #3980  
    Senior Member Christoffer Glans's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Stanley View Post
    I have a thought. I know it’s not a good enough format for tv and film, but I think this camera could benefit from having an option to record to mp4 files.

    Reason being that this is a camera that will be used by a lot of on the go shooters. It will be placed along with dji Mavics, 360 cams, go pros ect... they all shoot mp4.

    MP4 is a very handy format for ‘quick’ edits say on a small laptop or as is becoming popular an iPad Pro. I know reds image is way to good to be compressed to mp4 but the option could come in very handy. I guess that’s what DSLRs are for thou.

    Anyway Just a thought.
    You will be able to through a phone, but I would say that mp4 is a terrible format for "quick edits". Mp4 is very taxing on the system and you would be better off having a lower ProRes format instead. Even on my high end machine, I usually transcode mp4s to ProRes or DNxHR before editing. Never go for high taxing long GOP formats when doing something fast. Mp4 is better as a distribution format.
    "Using any digital cinema camera today is like sending your 35mm rolls to a standard lab. -Using a Red is like owning a dark room."
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