Thread: Red for Run and gun in the jungle

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  1. #21  
    Senior Member Robert Hofmeyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreasOberg View Post
    Hiya Robert, How are you?
    Interesting point with the DJI Osmo. Have not read anything about. However every time I try a small camera like GoPro I get so disappointed with the results. But of course coverage is more important than quality (sniff) so could be handy.

    Best,
    Andreas
    Hey Andreas, I am well thanks.

    I don't own an Osmo Pocket, but I've played with them a bit. Very neat little camera. So easy and tiny. Does motion timelapses as well. Haven't spent time looking closely at the footage, but I would guess it will be similar to the consumer DJI drones - fine in the right conditions, but not so great if you need to push it. It will certainly get you shots that would be impossible with a bigger rig.
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  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by AndreasOberg View Post
    Regarding 50-1000 I saw that for a documentary about orangutangs they were using it in the jungle. Hard to imagine being without it I would say, but its not fun to carry!

    .....................

    Best,
    Andreas


    Hi Andreas,

    Using a 50 ~ 1000 in the wild may not be that much of an issue if you could convince or hire a couple of Orangutans to carry the darn thing. I don't know how local labor laws work but, I'm sure it's quite inexpensive to get man of the jungle to work for you. You know....... could always pay them with bananas!

    Just my 2 cents :)


    Anyways, good luck on your next adventure.
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  3. #23  
    Senior Member Russ Fill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Björn Benckert View Post
    This might sound crazy but latly I used gopro7 as microphone. Best wind cancelation ever and it also work underwater and in all weather conditions. if you mount it on your camera / mattebox / rods or what ever it works great. Put big cards in it and feed it power from camera usb. Works great with voice command "GoPro start recording" etc.

    And yes, compared to other microphones it got the advantage edge of being able to also roll stabilized 4k while picking up its sound. If nothing else that picture is nice to have when syncing, but also, can works as b cam and or rescue missed takes. But yes, you can also roll on low res not to waist media.

    Im no sound guy so those that know better will likely say gopros are shit sound devices and possibly so. But I managed to capture audio that did not get too much complains from the sound studio. And yes it was far better than what I managed to get other times when I tried to handle much more advanced equipement and simply recorded to high or low or not at all. :)

    For vfx it gives a wider les dof image that is coming from the same camera move which is great for tracking etc...especially if using large not so straight anas... :)


    Teddy use it all the time.

    Gopro mic by Björn Benckert, on Flickr
    Ok I'll ask...Bjorn, what the heck is that lens and how does it work or what is it for.
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  4. #24  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Abeynayake View Post
    Hi Andreas,

    Using a 50 ~ 1000 in the wild may not be that much of an issue if you could convince or hire a couple of Orangutans to carry the darn thing. I don't know how local labor laws work but, I'm sure it's quite inexpensive to get man of the jungle to work for you. You know....... could always pay them with bananas!

    Anyways, good luck on your next adventure.
    Hiya Neil, haha, yea you are absolutely right. I think if we do this project there is a pretty good chance that someone will help.
    I kid you not but I sometimes carry 50kg when we go out. In those cases I would normally not walk more than 20 minutes or so at a time. In Sri Lanka I carried 33kg for most of the day in 40C. We found these clever special forces backpacks that really distribute the weight, they are HUGE.

    This time I hope I can have someone else carry tripod and extra things to save weight!

    Best wishes,
    Andreas
    www.ObergWildlife.com- Natural History Filmmaking
    www.WildlifeRescueMovie.com- Saving the animals of the Rainforest!
    RED DSCM2 8K Helium Movi Pro Gimbal, Inspire 2 X7, OConnor 2560, Canon CN20x50 50-1000mm
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  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Russ Fill View Post
    Ok I'll ask...Bjorn, what the heck is that lens and how does it work or what is it for.
    Its the 50 mm from my pet project: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthr...aScope-Baltars

    Its possibly not the best lens for the jungle, even though its what they used for the bridge over the river kwai. ;)
    Björn Benckert
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  6. #26  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    That is a very cool lens Björn. Possibly not the best for the jungle, but hey if it worked on The Bridge over the river Kwai, it MUST be good enough.

    We are leaning towards a Helium. Yes Gemini would be nice for the light sensitivity, but if you film in HD aspect it is only 13MP resolution vs 33MP with Helium which I think is just too big of a difference. I looked at several test images and the Gemini is considerably less sharp when you downsample to UHD vs Helium downsampled.

    Anyone tried the new ultra bright screens? Considering getting 2 of them. Have seem them at a trade show and though they looked nice, but they did not look THAT bright too me.

    Cheers
    Andreas
    www.ObergWildlife.com- Natural History Filmmaking
    www.WildlifeRescueMovie.com- Saving the animals of the Rainforest!
    RED DSCM2 8K Helium Movi Pro Gimbal, Inspire 2 X7, OConnor 2560, Canon CN20x50 50-1000mm
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  7. #27  
    Senior Member Robert Hofmeyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreasOberg View Post
    We are leaning towards a Helium. Yes Gemini would be nice for the light sensitivity, but if you film in HD aspect it is only 13MP resolution vs 33MP with Helium which I think is just too big of a difference. I looked at several test images and the Gemini is considerably less sharp when you downsample to UHD vs Helium downsampled.
    That's interesting. I wonder if anyone has done a controlled test with the same subject and lens.
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  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by AndreasOberg View Post
    Great information Gabriel, interesting to hear use in such extreme situations. A few points:
    - Boot time is not too big problem for us, for wildlife we usually have it on most of the time.
    - Fan noise. With the Epic it would be tricky to record audio because the fan was so loud. I have not been in a jungle with Helium so hard to know how aggresive it will be. For shorter takes you can of course turn it down a lot while recording, but if lots of things happening you may get longer takes and I would think the fan could kick in then.
    - We are actually leaning towards getting another Red camera instead of Canon/Sony. We are two camere operator (or one cameraman and one camerawoman!) so will be more fun and get us more shots if we are two of course. We do not film that many documentaries and I feel Red is clearly better for wildlife.
    - So the amplifiers in Helium are better than in Epic by the sound of it? I guess I will begin testing it more, a bit of a problem that it does not have phantom power unless you have the Production Module. Production module looks interesting but the only thing I need it for is the XLR inputs and phantom power and it does add some weight at 900g.
    I'm leaning towards a Gemini, this means we would be able to film in darker places. According to my tests you get 1.7 stops better than Helium. A monstro is another option, but cost more and is not quite as good in the dark, plus tricky to get coverage with many lenses.
    - How good are the color on the Gemini vs the Helium? Many tests I seen has a bit red cast which I'm not too happy with but I hear good things about the image too. Natalie just met Sophie Darlington and she prefered Gemini to Helium apparently.

    Once again, thanks for all the tips!
    Andreas

    -At this point, the Ranger version of the Gemini is so cheap, it's actually more cost effective to just get that rather than kit out a DSMC2 base. Then you'd have a powered XLR port in camera, and problem solved. That said, yes the amps in the DSMC2 line are far better. The audio is similar to what you get out of an A7S. Great for reference, will save your butt in a pinch, but not professional audio.

    -Sometimes I THINK I see subtle differences in contrast and greens/magentas, but I'm intercutting a feature with both cameras and they match perfectly. The Helium and Gemini are both IPP2, so they're essentially identical, and with the raw image in the same color science, you can easily adjust any tint that you see.

    Preferences are preferences. The Gemini is gorgeous, and if you're a slow-mo chap, being able to get up to 120fps without cropping into the sensor can leave that really nice large sensor aesthetic on your high-speed stuff, so that can be quite nice. That said...the Helium image is insane. The extra level of detail and sharpness really does take the image into the surreal and it has an almost CGI look to it. It's impossibly clean. Nature stuff is where my Helium gets the most play, because I think that's its wheelhouse...lots of resolution for composing multiple shots in 1, copious detail. I've also come to enjoy playing it safe and living on a wider lens on the Helium and rely on the 8K image to punch in if I need it, rather than losing shots during lens changes, or getting surprised by close action. Either camera will melt your face off with its image, and though the Helium does quite well in low-light, the LL mode on Gemini will be a godsend for you if you anticipate doing lots of low light shooting.
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  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Hofmeyr View Post
    That's interesting. I wonder if anyone has done a controlled test with the same subject and lens.
    Its difficult to do a proper test they are both good but at dofferent things and as sensorsize and pixelpitch differ you need to optimize lens and settings for each sensor. You can not just take the same lens same stop etc and compare then your results will be slanted one way or the or the other.
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  10. #30  
    Senior Member AndreasOberg's Avatar
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    Any ideas on how I would attach a Sound Devices Mixpre to the Helium? For our Epic I had the Red cage around it so it was easy to screw on. Not sure what would make sense with DSMC2 though. I see the Mix Pre has what looks like 2 1/4" screw holes on the side that I would probably use.

    One thing that is odd with the Mix Pre is that it sends timecode with HDMI. Not sure how to get that into the camera.
    Andreas
    www.ObergWildlife.com- Natural History Filmmaking
    www.WildlifeRescueMovie.com- Saving the animals of the Rainforest!
    RED DSCM2 8K Helium Movi Pro Gimbal, Inspire 2 X7, OConnor 2560, Canon CN20x50 50-1000mm
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