Thread: 8K to 4K for editing and composite Best codec?

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  1. #1 8K to 4K for editing and composite Best codec? 
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    Shot in 8K. Want easy post of Premiere editing and After Effects compositions. What should I convert the 8K Raw to?

    4K finish is acceptable.


    Prores HQ 4444 8K in my experience is difficult.

    Trash can Mac.
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  2. #2  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Dease View Post
    Shot in 8K. Want easy post of Premiere editing and After Effects compositions. What should I convert the 8K Raw to?

    4K finish is acceptable.


    Prores HQ 4444 8K in my experience is difficult.

    Trash can Mac.
    Cineform is the lowest on compute resources.

    https://blog.frame.io/2017/02/13/50-...decs-compared/

    Or use proxies and do the final render with the 8k.R3D source material.
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member Marcus Friedlander's Avatar
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    If you’re just looking to do a proxy workflow I would use prores proxy or maybe cineform.

    If you are looking for a codec to cut and the. Also finish in I would go with prores 4444xq, or if your computer can’t handle that then whatever the highest level of prores it can handle.
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  4. #4  
    Senior Member DJ Meyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Dease View Post
    Shot in 8K. Want easy post of Premiere editing and After Effects compositions. What should I convert the 8K Raw to?

    4K finish is acceptable.


    Prores HQ 4444 8K in my experience is difficult.

    Trash can Mac.
    Turn your timeline preview res down until performance is acceptable and use the raw files.

    Premiere on OSX+AMD is kind of a dumpster fire but even then it should be alright at 1/8 or so.

    Heavy AE work though would benefit from Prores. It's r3d perf is pretty bad even on Windows.
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    Senior Member Eric Santiago's Avatar
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    Last feature I had to assemble was 8K R3Ds.
    On the nMP D700, I was able to move around a little and playback in Premiere/FCPX.
    I think my OWC RAID helped.
    Now as far as editing, I wouldnt dare.
    I like my sanity.
    < Someday I'll be cool enough to have something witty here >
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  6. #6  
    Senior Member Jarek Zabczynski's Avatar
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    I'm still editing 8k r3d on a 2012 Mac Pro tower at 1/4 res and works fine. Why do I constantly see people struggling to do the same with better hardware than me?
    Shoot for the Impossible...Then do it.

    Jarek Zabczynski
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  7. #7  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    Though the typical workflow for VFX and editing is usually "not the same codec", I've seen it done mainly in television these days where using 4K ProRes 4444 is used for both. Heck I see ProRes HQ used for TV stuff a lot. Not exactly ideal if you are generating multiple versions as ProRes is indeed lossy, but sometimes speed is a priority over final image quality.

    More often editing is done with proxies, especially on larger projects, then linking back to your source or ready for final export material. Then VFX is usually done either in DPX, EXR, or TIF sequences. Nowadays since REDCODE RAW works everywhere, it can also be used. Or something like an 8K ProRes 4444 or 4444 XQ.

    The main issue with editing from an 8K ProRes 4444 is about 560MB/s a second with 4444 XQ getting up to 810MB/s. REDCODE RAW 8K 5:1 is about 260MB/s. On a snappy editing timeline you can see some of the issues that come into play here.

    As mentioned, editing in Full, 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, or even 1/16th helps drastically. Particularly on older systems.

    If you are looking or a high speed editing experience you want to use a codec that your system's through put can handle rather quickly. Which is why when you see feature films edited with upwards of 2000-3000 shots with multiple takes, proxies are ideal until you get closer to the end of the line.

    I personally mainly have been editingnatively with REDCODE RAW for a long while now. 4K, 5K, 6K, and now 8K. But I have the ecosystem and hardware to support that workflow. Generally though I'm not producing much content on my own over 30-45 minutes however. If I was going to push out a full 90-120 minute edit I'd mull over between native R3D or a proxy workflow. Mainly on the proxy side of things so I could literally take small proxy files with me on a laptop without trucking around larger drives during the edit until I have picture lock. If it was something I'm working on at the office only, native R3D would actually work for me even at this project scale.
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  8. #8  
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    Didn't know that thread blew up and THANK YOU, and thank you Phil.

    I am using the R3D for simplicity in editing at 1/16
    BUT ABOUT TO begin compositing some shots in after effects
    And unfortunately they are night shots which I think will get a bit destroyed going through a couple layers of conversion... But maybe I can use the R3D in AE now? Will be finding out within a few days.

    Compositing 4K stock footage over 8K R3D (?). Hm...
    Hence why 4K R3D would be perfect.

    Though wasn't endgame 2K visual effects, how is that even possible.
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  9. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarek Zabczynski View Post
    I'm still editing 8k r3d on a 2012 Mac Pro tower at 1/4 res and works fine. Why do I constantly see people struggling to do the same with better hardware than me?
    Are you layering anything?

    I plan to use After Effects. Last time I used after effects with "8K" footage I had my a__ handed to me 10 hours a day for eight days straight. Was not a pleasant experience... Nearly broke the trash can Mac. Simple layering and roto.

    Editing footage is fine. Until you do anything else.
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  10. #10  
    Senior Member DJ Meyer's Avatar
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    R3d within After Effects is...unpleasant. Which is too bad because performance in Premiere is excellent.

    Strongly recommend proxies for AE for anything more than the simplest of work.
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