Thread: The perfect Gemini Kit for me?

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  1. #1 The perfect Gemini Kit for me? 
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    I'm a director who wants to move from a c200 to a Gemini. I'll keep the c200 for b cam. The look I love most is the Alexa mini with Atlas anamorphic lenses, luted but rich pastel colors and natural HBO indie lighting. (If that's even a thing) I'm going RED over Arri though for frame rate and costs. 100% of my content is destined for social media, YouTube and local cable commercials. I'll rarely ever need to deliver 5k final video. Definitely never 8k. My questions are:
    1. Is Gemini the best sensor for anamorphic?
    2. Are atlas the cheapest anamorphic that will work with the Gemini?
    3. Is there a usable kit for under 35k with red armor new?
    4. Can I easily edit R3D 5k on a 2019 max iMac? With heavy grades and effects in FCPX?
    5. Coming from a C200 what should I know and prepare myself for?
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  2. #2  
    Senior Member Jeff Barklage's Avatar
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    Please please please make a Full Frame Gemini, with high frame rate capabilities..and I will buy a pair!
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    Jeff Barklage, s.o.c.
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  3. #3  
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    I can help answer a couple of your questions.

    2. SLR Magic makes 1.33x anamorphic lenses that are much cheaper than Atlas. But, I mean ... just look at them. I like the idea of a 1.33x squeeze using the full Gemini sensor, but they look awful (unless you're into that sort of thing).

    4. I edit on my base-level iMac Pro using FCP, and barely lifts a finger playing back 5K with multiple LUTs and color corrections, at least using the "better performance" setting. I think the 2019 iMac will do just fine. You'll need to generate ProRes ("optimized media") for things like noise reduction and stabilization, but you'll never need proxies again.
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  4. #4  
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    Why not considering a used Alexa if it’s the look you like? A ready to shoot full Alexa XT Plus kit, with 4 x 512GB cards, card reader, viewfinder, some accessories will cost 20k, calibration and checking at Arri Service Center included. You can shoot up to 120fps (S35) uncompressed, you can shoot 4/3. It’s a perfect camera for anamorphic. And editing and grading is less power hungry than Red.
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  5. #5  
    1. Is Gemini the best sensor for anamorphic?
    It's great for anamorphic yes.

    2. Are atlas the cheapest anamorphic that will work with the Gemini?
    The cheapest real anamorphic lenses yes. You can buy old scopes like the Kowa 8z, 16h and BH and products from RapidoTechnology and have yourself some pretty awesome anamorphics for more like $2000 per but they don't always function the same on set. They are a very solid alternative.

    3. Is there a usable kit for under 35k with red armor new?
    There are a lot of used kits for $22k ish and Red service is excellent.

    4. Can I easily edit R3D 5k on a 2019 max iMac? With heavy grades and effects in FCPX?
    Yes and yes. Redcode is easy.

    5. Coming from a C200 what should I know and prepare myself for?
    Besides the cost of everything a solid background of filming, coloring and learning from your mistakes is a good thing. I see a lot of folks going Red with out a solid foundation of basics in lighting, exposure, etc and their capturing absolute junk. The camera isn't going to magically make everything look better. A real cinema camera like the Gemini, Arri, even FS7 will actually show you how bad you are and will teach you how to light etc. Red and the image is amazing. If you love this stuff, pick one up and dive in head first. If you're planning on spending $25k know you'll most likely need another $5-10k for things you may not have thought of ie, media, support, modules, monitors, wireless, lenses, motion control etc. Have fun!
    Multiple hat wearing director and cinematographer based but not bound in the greater New York area.
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  6. #6  
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    Julian's answer are spot on... I also own a Gemini and can attest that I would choose it over Alexa mini for 2X anamorphic as well as definitely for frame rates, form factor, modularity, and price (also check out this link if you don't believe me)...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ibs_Uc0YQ0

    I fly through 5k footage on my 2019 15" and 16" MBP and can even handle 8k like a breeze if I need. Media is actually cheap (outside of mini-mags) but you can get a 2tb Samsung T5 SSD for about $300 today. I have about 10 of them that I can travel with. Shoot stuff on Kowa's and Atlas a lot and it looks great and really organic.... They are great lenses to rent, but at 35k-90k for a set, like Julian said I'd recommend to buy old scopes like the Kowa 16h and match them with a cool vintage cine-mod taking lens (i.e. Zeiss contax, Canon FD, Leica R, etc.) with a Rapido Technology mod and have yourself a pretty awesome anamorphic set for a quarter or eighth of the price. Have some friends that own sets like that and their anamorphic footage looks great and best part about it is they didn't invest insane amount of money to get basically the same result and they don't have to rely on renting when they want to choose that look. Those remaining dollars would be better spent in lighting, stabilization, production gear, or even a set of spherical cinema lenses as a standard reliable go to for doc / commercial work where anamorphic look might not be the look you always want on every project. It's better to have options in my opinion.

    I think we will see a full frame 6-8k Gemini when DSCM3 comes out with built in ND's and autofocus (probably not as good as canon but still a nice addition). At least that's what I am hoping for but I think that's still at a minimum a 1-1.5 years away as Komodo hasn't even dropped yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Julien Jarry View Post
    1. Is Gemini the best sensor for anamorphic?
    It's great for anamorphic yes.

    2. Are atlas the cheapest anamorphic that will work with the Gemini?
    The cheapest real anamorphic lenses yes. You can buy old scopes like the Kowa 8z, 16h and BH and products from RapidoTechnology and have yourself some pretty awesome anamorphics for more like $2000 per but they don't always function the same on set. They are a very solid alternative.

    3. Is there a usable kit for under 35k with red armor new?
    There are a lot of used kits for $22k ish and Red service is excellent.

    4. Can I easily edit R3D 5k on a 2019 max iMac? With heavy grades and effects in FCPX?
    Yes and yes. Redcode is easy.

    5. Coming from a C200 what should I know and prepare myself for?
    Besides the cost of everything a solid background of filming, coloring and learning from your mistakes is a good thing. I see a lot of folks going Red with out a solid foundation of basics in lighting, exposure, etc and their capturing absolute junk. The camera isn't going to magically make everything look better. A real cinema camera like the Gemini, Arri, even FS7 will actually show you how bad you are and will teach you how to light etc. Red and the image is amazing. If you love this stuff, pick one up and dive in head first. If you're planning on spending $25k know you'll most likely need another $5-10k for things you may not have thought of ie, media, support, modules, monitors, wireless, lenses, motion control etc. Have fun!
    Last edited by Andrew Reese; 05-23-2020 at 01:13 PM.
    R3D DSMC2 GEMINI
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  7. #7  
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    1. Is Gemini the best sensor for anamorphic?
    Next to Monstro, it's RED's tallest (which is good for anamorphic).

    2. Are atlas the cheapest anamorphic that will work with the Gemini?
    There are other used options and adapters, but the Atlas Anamorphics are the easiest (single focus, new/available, not Hawk expensive).

    3. Is there a usable kit for under 35k with red armor new?
    There are definitely Gemini kits for <$35k (especially used), but I don't think RED armour is transferable.

    4. Can I easily edit R3D 5k on a 2019 max iMac? With heavy grades and effects in FCPX?
    In FCPX, with "Performance Playback", you'd certainly be able to get by with a maxed out 2019 iMac. Not sure it'd be "easy", but I think it can manage.

    5. Coming from a C200 what should I know and prepare myself for?
    Battery consumption, media, no autofocus, and weight. You'll need v-mounts/ab-mounts and those alone weigh almost as much as c200 (unless you get minis). 96wh will only last ~1.5hours or less. Media is expensive for the amount you get and you'll be ripping through mags if you're doing a lot of slow-mo (2x480s should suffice... but that's like $3000). There's also no autofocus, but the lenses you're looking at don't have AF. The brain weighs 3.5lbs... BUT, you'll need to add *at least* 2lbs (IO module, lens mount, handle) just to be able to turn the camera on and control it. Add a 2.5lb battery, 1lbs monitor, 2.5lbs lens and you'll easily be >10lbs without matte box/audio/rods/gack. Whereas the c200 is what? 5lbs completely rigged with 2hrs of battery and XLRs and monitor?
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