Thread: Call for better audio recording on newer RED cameras.

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  1. #81  
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    https://www.sonosax.ch/category/news/sononews/

    Thread discussion: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthr...n-SONOSAX-M2D2

    Looks like it falls in line with some of what people have been suggesting for achieving better in camera audio.

    Take the insides of a device like this, add 2 more inputs, and put it into a new gen RED Audio module.
    Will instantly have decent RED audio that is more streamlined into the camera system and less frankensteined.

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  2. #82  
    Senior Member Blair S. Paulsen's Avatar
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    Can anyone confirm that the RED RedVolt Expander with 2 XLR inputs records clean sound? If so, the real issue is the form factor of the RV expander. I agree with the idea that RED left the door open for 3rd parties to meet the needs of RedUsers with options suited to multiple shooting styles. Good concept, but problematic in practice - long development timelines, customer price sensitivity and modest sales volume is hardly a capitalist dream scenario.

    As noted previously, the crucial message to RED is perhaps more about deep engagement with respected 3rd party partners well in advance of the debut of DSMC3. The timeline for release of modules for DSMC2 meant a huge percentage of buyers went with the Base Expander so they could start shooting right away. Many RedUsers, myself included, just assumed that a more evolved module with key features - whether from RED, OH, etc - would come along and offer enough added value to justify the spend. If an OMOD with the particular feature set I was looking for had come out in 2017 I would have snapped it up. Unfortunately for me, Mark targeted specific use cases that he had reason to believe would be popular instead. Not a criticism, it's what any rational vendor would do when rolling out a new product line, just didn't happen to suit my needs.

    IAC, I'm really attracted to the little Sonosax M2D2 but really wish it had a little SD card recording capacity upstream from the camera's audio section. It would provide redundancy and potentially save you if there was any issue with the signal path into camera. Yes, for the umpteenth time, a proper sound person with their own recording facility is what any smart producer should do - but that's a different thread.

    Cheers - #19
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  3. #83  
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    I have and use the RedVolt Expander all the time with perfect audio. It certainly helps to have a good feed from a professional sound opp person's mixer. However, I've used the audio straight in from a quality boom mic many times for interviews and such. I've even done side by side comparisons with the audio tech's files recorded from their mixer and could not tell a difference from the r3d's audio in post.
    Of course I'm not recommending for large scale productions for high end broadcast commercial or film work. But for most internet delivery or even low budget film work I think the RedVolt is a great solution.
    RED Epic-W Helium 8k
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  4. #84  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Timmons View Post
    4) Clean audio with no digital pops, hiss, or other phenomena that contaminates the signal.
    (according to some user reports)

    Brian Timmons
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    I get these digital pops and hiss with every pro audio setup I can think of on both my Weapon and Raven.. I'm not sure if I have a bad DSMC2 Base Expander or if DSMC2 audio was not intended to be used. There are less "pops" if I use a 302 mixer or a Tuscam mixer/recorder combo as the preamp. If I connect the battery powered mics directly to the RED (without using a preamp) the audio pops are so bad it is unusable. This is unfortunate, bc lately we had our sound department cut- I've been one man banding news packages with no time/resources for dual system audio.
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  5. #85  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Fredericks View Post
    I get these digital pops and hiss with every pro audio setup I can think of on both my Weapon and Raven.. I'm not sure if I have a bad DSMC2 Base Expander or if DSMC2 audio was not intended to be used. There are less "pops" if I use a 302 mixer or a Tuscam mixer/recorder combo as the preamp. If I connect the battery powered mics directly to the RED (without using a preamp) the audio pops are so bad it is unusable. This is unfortunate, bc lately we had our sound department cut- I've been one man banding news packages with no time/resources for dual system audio.
    Are you on Firmware 7.0.1? This was a known issue (I personally had this issue), and it was fixed in version 7.0.2 or 7.0.3 if I remember correctly.
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  6. #86 Abox and Helium noixe 
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    I too am having issues with noise coming across the Abox into my Helium. Having to record to an audio recorder and sync in post. Not the end of the world, but a time killer when time is money in post.

    Using Lectro Wirelesses and NTG3 powered mic.


    Curious if this is also a problem with the Production Module that has the built in XLR? May have to spring for it, but it would increase weight on my camera and I'm trying to go as light as possible as most of my stuff is run and gun docu style.
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  7. #87  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Womack View Post
    I too am having issues with noise coming across the Abox into my Helium. Having to record to an audio recorder and sync in post. Not the end of the world, but a time killer when time is money in post.
    If you at least use timecode then that should reduce the time spent to a snap of the fingers.
    http://IronFilm.co.nz/Sound/ (Sound Recordist based in Auckland, NZ. Happy to travel too)
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  8. #88  
    Senior Member Michael Lindsay's Avatar
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    if the A-box desont have a in-line ground loop isolator built in it is pretty much worthless bulky junk IMHO.... DSMC2 needs a ground loop isolator for many Audio situations...

    How do you power you Lectro RX?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Womack View Post
    I too am having issues with noise coming across the Abox into my Helium. Having to record to an audio recorder and sync in post. Not the end of the world, but a time killer when time is money in post.

    Using Lectro Wirelesses and NTG3 powered mic.


    Curious if this is also a problem with the Production Module that has the built in XLR? May have to spring for it, but it would increase weight on my camera and I'm trying to go as light as possible as most of my stuff is run and gun docu style.
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  9. #89  
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    Canon and Sony supports 4 XLR channels in their latest mid range cinema cameras.

    C500 Mkii
    https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/p...s-c500-mark-ii

    FX9
    https://pro.sony/en_GB/products/hand...sBlock-pxw-fx9

    Naturally, I hope RED takes notice and acts.

    While I highly doubt RED Komodo will support anything like 4 channels, it would be nice if integration (i.e trigger record) with a recorder like the Zoom F6 can be made.
    https://zoom-na.com/products/field-v...field-recorder

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  10. #90  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    Looking at what has transpired since the launch of DSMC2 with the previously available REDVOLT Module (2X Phantom Power XLR), to the various 3rd parties that missed the mark wildly and had tech issues, to the two iterations of the OMOD XLR module (2X Phantom Power XLR), and now finally the Production Module (2X Phantom Power XLR) as well as the Ranger model (1X 5-pin Stereo XLR), I truly want DSMC3 to be a bit more audio friendly out of the gate. Module or not.

    RED certainly is a film-style camera, audio hasn't been the priority on the body due to the more typical workflow of having a dedicated sound guy or field recorder. However, the market is diverse and many, many filmmakers need to capture high quality audio in camera and even potentially just higher quality scratch audio.

    What I'd truly like to see in DSMC3 is the ability to have 4X to 6X audio feeds into the camera. Whether than manifests in a robust Production Module w/ 2X 5-pin Stereo XLRs or 4X XLRs. 2X XLR stereo is my only really mandatory requirment for any camera system on a high end model. Meanwhile potential internal wireless audio technology is slowly maturing and potentially could show up in camera or via module.

    I think if we could turn back time to DSMC2's launch and the Production Module was around back then, it would have really helped a variety of documentary filmmakers, ENG, as well as a few small crew talking head-style shooters I spoke to over the course of several years who struggled with on location sound.

    Komodo's focus is a super compact camera, I'm not heartbroken by no XLR-type connection for audio, but I know many people who will be recording sound into this thing especially at this price point. You'll likely need a decent Pre-Amp to make that happen in this case. Luckily those are both small and relatively inexpensive to fit within the general rigging footprint Komodo inspires.
    Phil Holland - Cinematographer - Los Angeles
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