Thread: Weapon 8K Vs Epic-W: Differences?

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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by Björn Benckert View Post
    I don't see it as I throw pixels away when I downsample. As it improves noise, sharpness etc. And dubbling the horisontal pixels is quite the opposite of that. But sure if you need to make a 4096x1716 or what ever format that is bigger than what the camera can capture than thats the only way.
    You have me confused Bjorn. Don't you always have to double the pixels when shooting anamorphic and then scale to whatever format you want? I'm guessing as I can't find the actual frame size on the red website but wouldn't Dragon shoot 3792 x 3160 (6:5) and then you would double horizontal pixels and scale down to 4K? Same as Alexa mini? The mini shoots about 1K less in either direction (2631 x 2202) but does shoot about a 20% larger picture area. By the way I am asking these as questions as I am trying to figure out the anamorphic thing.
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  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Holland View Post
    Two main considerations when talking Weapon 8K S35 and Epic-W is maximum data rate and maximum frame rates. Some people truly will need 8K at 60fps for instance (myself included!).

    It's always good to look at everything to see the various differences between models. As usual I have a chart for such things:

    http://phfx.com/tools/REDDSMC2Camera...et2016_big.png


    Side note and on topic-ish thing. Epic Dragon and Weapon 6K S35 Dragon. Many have been working 5K-6K. 8K is indeed the new concept many are exploring. Helium sensor tech results in 7K being around Super 35mm in width, so I think for those shooting 5K say on Dragon, you may find your comfort zone around 7K Helium. Unless you're target delivery is 8K, then for sure shoot 8K.

    There are notable differences between the two sensor technologies on a per format basis. Some come down to resolution and format, some come down say image texture.
    Hey Phil,

    Been investigating on this and just about any awesome piece of info came from you, haha.


    I am slightly confused... Looking at cropping images, Epic 8k Helium super 35 has slightly the same sensor size as Epic Dragon at 6k, correct?
    And at 6k it would be equal to Epic dragon at 4k? Am I doing ok?

    I was looking for a chart dedicated to the Epic 8k Helium resolutions, but could not find one... (just in case one exists, not like it is up to you to make it...)

    Thanks in advance
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  3. #23  
    Senior Member Tom Greenberg's Avatar
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    You can compare any 2 formats by using Phil's awesome PHFX "formatCompare" tool. http://www.phfx.com/tools/formatCompare/
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  4. #24  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    Thank you Tom! And yep, that web tool allows you to create a comparison yourself!

    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos Garcia View Post
    I was looking for a chart dedicated to the Epic 8k Helium resolutions, but could not find one... (just in case one exists, not like it is up to you to make it...)
    Here you go:
    http://phfx.com/tools/formatCompare/...rmat=4.5K%20FF

    What you actually want is Helium 6K and Dragon 4.5K :)
    Phil Holland - Cinematographer - Los Angeles
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    2X RED Monstro 8K VV Bodies, 1X RED Komodo, and a lot of things to use with them.

    Data Sheets and Notes:
    Red Weapon/DSMC2
    Red Dragon
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  5. #25  
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    what is the reasoning for the dragon 6k ff being 1.03x larger than the helium 8k ff FOV? thanks!
    Weapon Helium 8K - 05280
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  6. #26  
    Senior Member Nick Morrison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul Robinson View Post
    what is the reasoning for the dragon 6k ff being 1.03x larger than the helium 8k ff FOV? thanks!
    I think it simply has todo with the different pixel sizes.

    It's a negligible difference by most standards. I don't think anyone would notice in the real world.
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  7. #27  
    Senior Member Zeb B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Sandman View Post
    snip . . . but I'm also keeping in mind that I'm buying into one of the premium upgrade paths
    What has been published by RED on this "premium upgrade path" of Epic-W v. Weapon?
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  8. #28  
    Senior Member Zeb B's Avatar
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    Second question:
    If Weapon can double the Frame Rate of Epic-W at 8K . . . why can it not do so at all Frame Rates, like 4K @240fps. That would be awesome
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  9. #29  
    Moderator Phil Holland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeb B View Post
    Second question:
    If Weapon can double the Frame Rate of Epic-W at 8K . . . why can it not do so at all Frame Rates, like 4K @240fps. That would be awesome
    That would be awesome, but that is indeed a readout speed limitation of the sensor tech.

    For now.
    Phil Holland - Cinematographer - Los Angeles
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    2X RED Monstro 8K VV Bodies, 1X RED Komodo, and a lot of things to use with them.

    Data Sheets and Notes:
    Red Weapon/DSMC2
    Red Dragon
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  10. #30  
    Senior Member Zeb B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Holland View Post
    That would be awesome, but that is indeed a readout speed limitation of the sensor tech.

    For now.
    Boy, sure would be cool if RED released a firmware update for Weapon to allow the frame rate increase to include 2K-5K before the September 28th deadline. 240fps @4K would very neato and help cover the $20K premium over the Epic-W.

    So nothing formal on the Weapon v Epic-W future upgrade priority?
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