Thread: Any ideas for a four-track snake???

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  1. #1 Any ideas for a four-track snake??? 
    Hi all. . .

    Assuming that the REDAlert audio-stripping issue is quickly resolved, I would LOVE to avoid having to double-system all of our audio. If we WERE to avoid using a double system (just take four track straight out of our SD 442), can anyone recommend a great, lightweight four-line snake for getting the audio out of the 442 and into the RED?

    Thanks much.

    Stephen
    Scarlet Dragon with Canon, Sigma, and Tokina lenses and the Optitron 2 wireless focus system
    First feature film, Works in Progress, out on DVD (Vanguard Cinema) and online.
    Second feature film, the miniseries Terminal, currently available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07R8RQ488
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    Fourth feature film, The Land, currently under review at film festivals around the world.
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  2. #2  
    Senior Member David Birdy's Avatar
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    Stephen,

    I just sent you a PM, I can make a 4 channel snake for you.

    Dave
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member Shawn Nelson's Avatar
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    I would love a snake that grabs the four channels of audio plus the two channels of return monitoring (the five-pin port) and then snakes it back 50 ft.
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  4. #4  
    Senior Member Shawn Nelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by battistella View Post
    Any decent audio house can make this to order for you Shawn. I am having one made in the next few days so I can e-mail you RE: costs etc. if you like. I'll have a quote tomorrow.

    David
    Excellent! Exactly what I described?

    I guess to further refine the idea, I'd have the camera side of the snake be four mini XLRs and the 5-pin balanced camera return that would then break about 18" from the camera (to properly strain relief on the frame). Then after a 50' snake branch out to 4 full size XLRs and probably a 1/4" stereo return.

    Then I'd get a second "camera side" piece that would end up making channel 3 a copy of channel 1 and channel 4 a copy of channel 2. That way, for two channel recordings, you could do the standard trick of recording each channel at different safety settings.

    So yes David, please do post or PM me what you get quoted and for exactly what the cable is!
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  5. #5  
    Why wouldn't you want to be able to record all four tracks separately? On the 442 you've got "direct outs" for all four channels, all mini-XLR. The full-size XLRs output a mixed version of all four channels.

    For a 442, I'd think you'd want the mixer side to have two full-size XLRs and two mini-XLRs. That way you could do four separate channels of recording instead of having to mix down in the field.
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  6. #6  
    Senior Member Shawn Nelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Green View Post
    The full-size XLRs output a mixed version of all four channels.
    And there's the rub, the 442 isn't a full 4-to-4 channel mixer. It's a 4-to-2 mixer that will give you the other 2 channels pre-fade and pre-processor. On my NAB "to-do" list is to go to the SD booth and bitch to them about their lack of a true 4-to-4 mixer. Hopefully they'll respond that the SD444 is about to be released :-).

    The only reason for my second "snake-head" is for the case when you only have a two-channel mixer and you are only recording two channels, you might as well double up for the safety of recording at say, -12db and -20db.
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  7. #7  
    I'll be recording double-system and go from the 442 into a 744T and then out of the 744T and, via snake, into the RED. I could do that with four mic cables taped together, but I think a snake could save weight, possibly have breakaway connections, and offer a return off the camera back to the audio folks, just so they'll know if that signal is actually getting recorded to the camera.

    The 442 can be "more or less" used as 4 audio channels, however, with two fully-functioning audio control systems by just panning, say, channel 1 hard left and channel 2 hard right and taking the audio out of the "master mix." Channels 3 and 4 could be taken out from the direct outs on the other side of the 442, and in doing so you only give up using the big knob for gain control. You can still control gain via the smaller, pop-up knobs on those two channels (which isn't all that hard to do, frankly). All AGCs and compressors remain fully functional for each channel.

    With the combination of the 744T and 442, four mono channels can be mixed down to two (or even one channel) and then two faders on the 744T can be used for two additional inputs. Thus, the combination allows up to six preamps to be used, still allows you to record four independent tracks simultaneously, AND can feed the audio to the RED via the 744T's output connections.

    Is it perfect system? No. But for the money, it's pretty sweet.

    Stephen
    Scarlet Dragon with Canon, Sigma, and Tokina lenses and the Optitron 2 wireless focus system
    First feature film, Works in Progress, out on DVD (Vanguard Cinema) and online.
    Second feature film, the miniseries Terminal, currently available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07R8RQ488
    Third feature film, The Tree, currently available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07JJ179RP
    Fourth feature film, The Land, currently under review at film festivals around the world.
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  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Pruitt View Post
    Hi all. . .

    Assuming that the REDAlert audio-stripping issue is quickly resolved, I would LOVE to avoid having to double-system all of our audio. If we WERE to avoid using a double system (just take four track straight out of our SD 442), can anyone recommend a great, lightweight four-line snake for getting the audio out of the 442 and into the RED?

    Thanks much.

    Stephen
    In our experience there's nothing better than the ETS InstaSnake PA200 snake:

    http://www.etslan.com/

    It uses shield twisted pair, like a computer local area network.
    Len Moskowitz
    Core Sound
    Home of TetraMic
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  9. #9 I'm Confused 
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    I'm a bit confused. I did sound for a shoot on the Red this weekend and ran the 4 SD 442 direct outs into the 4 mini's on the Red. When we checked it in post, we had 4 channels of audio. It seems to work. I'm hoping to have a break away made with 4 mini out's for my 442 into 4 mini in's specifically for the Red this week. Any thoughts on this?
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  10. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Bell View Post
    I'm a bit confused. I did sound for a shoot on the Red this weekend and ran the 4 SD 442 direct outs into the 4 mini's on the Red. When we checked it in post, we had 4 channels of audio. It seems to work. I'm hoping to have a break away made with 4 mini out's for my 442 into 4 mini in's specifically for the Red this week. Any thoughts on this?
    I have 2 ENG breakaways for audio. this way when I only need 2 channels there is less cablle to drag around
    Paul Hazlett
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    "Cheesesteak" EPIC-X #000257
    "Gertrude" Scarlet-X #000128
    phaz@verizon.net
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